Curing Homosexuality?

[Valcrist]

Yup, i'm 16 years old kid with not so normal live to go... Meeting many people in my adolesence times and they're indirectly made my minds to became so mature before my age...

 

[Dissonance]

Yup, i'm 16 years old kid with not so normal live to go... Meeting many people in my adolesence times and they're indirectly made my minds to became so mature before my age...

Yeah, everybody at 16 thinks that.

The only way to know if it's true is to look back at yourself when you're 20+ and think "was I really right or wrong about things?"  :P

1. Caused by their traumatic life (ex: when they were child, they get raped by same gendered rapist, so when they grew up, they had a fetish to the same sex.) 

This is possible but goddamn, it is certainly not anywhere over 1% of all gay cases.

2. They had tired with the cross-gender relationship (ex: a nerdy boy got his love letter thrashed with many girls. And when his male friend came to cheer him up, he thinks that his friend are the one in his heart.)

Are you insane?  Have you even met a gay person before?  Have you even studied Queer Theory?

3. The media's affection (ex: Many media in TV and internet showed how popular same-gendered relationship that becomes a trend in youngsters nowadays. That's the one that cause many lesbian in this world. And some children or broken hearted nerdy came across with this subject, and it affects on how they are thinking.)

While this is true, it generally leads shallow blonde party girls to make out with a chick while drunk and claim they're "bicurious" for the next 6 months.  Nothing substantial comes of it.

Just try to get hold on yourself to not dragged into their world, and maybe help them to became 'normal' by change their view point or help them to cope their pronlem.

Multiple problems here.

1) Dragged into their world?  You act as if they're infectious, or trying to convert you.  You obviously know next to nothing about gay people.

2) Do read my post above on how society convinces us that certain sexual behavior is 'normal' and others are 'abnormal' when that's obviously not the case.  You are very obviously ingrained with the ideology of "one man, one woman" when it's quite obvious that that model was perpetuated in the past simply for the sake of reproduction and our current cultures have simply inherited it.

Long story short, you know nothing about gay people and need to do some research.

 

[bashful crobat]

My basic misunderstanding about homosexuality

I think that says it all. Oh wait, here's more.

1. Caused by their traumatic life (ex: when they were child, they get raped by same gendered rapist, so when they grew up, they had a fetish to the same sex.)

^Would be more likely to do the opposite, and make them fiercely homophobic.

2. They had tired with the cross-gender relationship (ex: a nerdy boy got his love letter thrashed with many girls. And when his male friend came to cheer him up, he thinks that his friend are the one in his heart.)

That's the worst explanation of homosexuality I've heard in a long time. Sexuality is not something you can truly chop-and-change just because something grows dull. Besides, if a guy can't get with a girl, there's a chance he won't get with a guy either.

Your third point is correct, as Dissonance said.

The only way to cure it are only make them change they viewpoint off sexual appeal.

Ehh...I'd to see someone try. You can't change something like that completely, and any attempts to do so can cause severe psychological conflicts, so I won't see anyone try anytime soon :>

Just try to get hold on yourself to not dragged into their world, and maybe help them to became 'normal' by change their view point or help them to cope their pronlem.

You're naive if you believe that at 16. Also, you just said that it wasn't a problem. Make up your mind, kid.

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

I'm actually in a really good mood so don't mind me if I seem a little bouncy here :grin:

1. Caused by their traumatic life (ex: when they were child, they get raped by same gendered rapist, so when they grew up, they had a fetish to the same sex.)

I know a large amount of homosexuals and none of them ever confessed to this at the very least.  Sure maybe one was, but has decided not to voice it and keep it secret, but for the most part I've never seen this.  I have known more straight people who were molested by same sex pervs.

As a matter o' fact, less than 30% of homosexuals that were molested at one point in their life were molested by same sex pervs.
Sure, that's only the amount that actually stepped forward and admitted it.  But let's face it, compared to the amount of straight people who were molested by the same sex.  A whopping 45% of sexually abused children who grow up straight were molested by same sex.

Destroy that argument please, it is an old school facet to a homophobic world that is simply not willing to let go of perceived notions that child molesters are gay.
Even most molesters who molest children aren't gay.  For example many male molesters who do molest male children, would rather have sexual relationships with a grown woman rather than a grown man.  It's like the castrati fetish - in their heads it's a third sex, something angelic and earthly.  Untarnished.
The fact that it's a boy, is a sign of puberty before the women destroy them.  In their heads that is.  It's not gay.

And that's where those thoughts come from.

2. They had tired with the cross-gender relationship (ex: a nerdy boy got his love letter thrashed with many girls. And when his male friend came to cheer him up, he thinks that his friend are the one in his heart.)

Okay to be honest I do know two cases where this happened.  However I dare say the curiosity existed long before hand.

Though only one is still gay to this day.  The other is now straight.  Then again I know lots of guys who struck out a lot.  I went to high school.  I hung out with the geeks and nerds and jocks and all the social cliques.  I could show you a guy whose still a virgin today and he's two years older than me.  In three years he'll be 30, and he's not gay - and he strikes out ALL the time, and us guys are always trying to cheer him up.
Maybe he's an exception.
Maybe all my lonely friends in my life are.

3. The media's affection (ex: Many media in TV and internet showed how popular same-gendered relationship that becomes a trend in youngsters nowadays. That's the one that cause many lesbian in this world. And some children or broken hearted nerdy came across with this subject, and it affects on how they are thinking.)

The only problem I have with this is the large amount of homosexuals around the world before the advent of television and before this became trendy.

I mean, my friend's grand mother used to talk to "the nice gay boys down the corner" back in her home of the Ukraine.  She's 85.
TV in the Ukraine at least 60 years ago?
I guess their hearts just got broken too much :x

Seriously homosexuals in movies and TV where they were portrayed in a good light was rare for most of film's existence.  It was only in porn that homosexuals were allowed to be gay.  And that's kind of sad.  It was only since the 90's that it really became some trend.  Sure there were spots in the 80's - but compared to the stereotypical antigay jokes and stuff?  Very very little and very poorly done.

Gay in the media up until the turn of the 90's was like black in the early days of film.  You had white guys going black face, only you had them acting overly feminine and making a joke of themselves.  That could be plausible for some younger audiences I'll hand you that - but c'mon.  You make it sound like if I bump into a lesbian it's because of musicians like that chick who did that "Come to my window" song.
Melissa Etherage?
Something like that.

Hell David Bowie probably turned more women lesbian that all the shows in the world - and that's before they found out he was just that awesome of a dude to pull off the "dykastomper" look.

And the homosexs are thinking and acting like a normal people, so there's no reason for avoiding them. Just try to get hold on yourself to not dragged into their world, and maybe help them to became 'normal' by change their view point or help them to cope their pronlem.

See I don't like this.  "...try to get hold on yourself to not dragged into their world,".  And the whole "change their view point or help them to cope with their problem".

What problem?  It's an 'alternative'.  The so-called 'abnormalities' only appear in a small amount of people.  There's less gay people than straight, and the numbers don't match up comparing statistics taken this millennium.  2001 on compared to 2000 and earlier shows a huge gap between these 'traumatic' experiences in gays and straights when you divy the ratio.

If anything - it's turning they have had more normal childhoods than we.
You know that dream?  The white picket family?  The good home style cookin'?

One day that'll be illegal in old thought countries - cause that produces more homosexuality than San Fransisco.

-honestly I have no idea where I was going with the 2nd half of this post.  A good song came on the radio and I started singing along and lost my train of thought :scruff:

 

[Valcrist]

1. Caused by their traumatic life (ex: when they were child, they get raped by same gendered rapist, so when they grew up, they had a fetish to the same sex.)

Dissonance: This is possible but goddamn, it is certainly not anywhere over 1% of all gay cases.

Holly: Would be more likely to do the opposite, and make them fiercely homophobic.

Sixtyandquarters: I know a large amount of homosexuals and none of them ever confessed to this at the very least.  Sure maybe one was, but has decided not to voice it and keep it secret, but for the most part I've never seen this.  I have known more straight people who were molested by same sex pervs.

As a matter o' fact, less than 30% of homosexuals that were molested at one point in their life were molested by same sex pervs.
Sure, that's only the amount that actually stepped forward and admitted it.  But let's face it, compared to the amount of straight people who were molested by the same sex.  A whopping 45% of sexually abused children who grow up straight were molested by same sex.

Destroy that argument please, it is an old school facet to a homophobic world that is simply not willing to let go of perceived notions that child molesters are gay.
Even most molesters who molest children aren't gay.  For example many male molesters who do molest male children, would rather have sexual relationships with a grown woman rather than a grown man.  It's like the castrati fetish - in their heads it's a third sex, something angelic and earthly.  Untarnished.
The fact that it's a boy, is a sign of puberty before the women destroy them.  In their heads that is.  It's not gay.

And that's where those thoughts come from.

Yeah, I agree With Sixty's point. The chance is pretty small, but it can be done. So i decided to write them down in my last post.

2. They had tired with the cross-gender relationship (ex: a nerdy boy got his love letter thrashed with many girls. And when his male friend came to cheer him up, he thinks that his friend are the one in his heart.)

Dissonance:Are you insane?  Have you even met a gay person before?  Have you even studied Queer Theory?

Holly:That's the worst explanation of homosexuality I've heard in a long time. Sexuality is not something you can truly chop-and-change just because something grows dull. Besides, if a guy can't get with a girl, there's a chance he won't get with a guy either.

sixtyandaquarter: Okay to be honest I do know two cases where this happened.  However I dare say the curiosity existed long before hand.

Though only one is still gay to this day.  The other is now straight.  Then again I know lots of guys who struck out a lot.  I went to high school.  I hung out with the geeks and nerds and jocks and all the social cliques.  I could show you a guy whose still a virgin today and he's two years older than me.  In three years he'll be 30, and he's not gay - and he strikes out ALL the time, and us guys are always trying to cheer him up.
Maybe he's an exception.
Maybe all my lonely friends in my life are.

My illustrator are the most suitable example for this. He had broken-hearted by many woman and i'm trying to cheer him up, which is probably my biggest mistake to him. He started to chase me, saying that i'm the one he's looking for. And the story cames to the end when i say i'm still like girls and he turned out with another guy who shares the same stories like him.

This is the true story that happened in my life. I know it's sound impossible, but it really happens in my adolesencehood. I may be never studied Queer Theory before, but maybe i'm more experienced in  this case than those smart-ass whitecoats geeks who just looks gay from the theoritical side. (making a pill / medication to cure gay? Hah! Big LOL!  :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin

3. The media's affection (ex: Many media in TV and internet showed how popular same-gendered relationship that becomes a trend in youngsters nowadays. That's the one that cause many lesbian in this world. And some children or broken hearted nerdy came across with this subject, and it affects on how they are thinking.)

And the homosexs are thinking and acting like a normal people, so there's no reason for avoiding them. Just try to get hold on yourself to not dragged into their world, and maybe help them to became 'normal' by change their view point or help them to cope their problem.

Dissonance: Multiple problems here.

1) Dragged into their world?  You act as if they're infectious, or trying to convert you.  You obviously know next to nothing about gay people.

2) Do read my post above on how society convinces us that certain sexual behavior is 'normal' and others are 'abnormal' when that's obviously not the case.  You are very obviously ingrained with the ideology of "one man, one woman" when it's quite obvious that that model was perpetuated in the past simply for the sake of reproduction and our current cultures have simply inherited it.

Holly:You're naive if you believe that at 16. Also, you just said that it wasn't a problem. Make up your mind, kid.

sixtyandaquarter: See I don't like this.  "...try to get hold on yourself to not dragged into their world,".  And the whole "change their view point or help them to cope with their problem".

What problem?  It's an 'alternative'.  The so-called 'abnormalities' only appear in a small amount of people.  There's less gay people than straight, and the numbers don't match up comparing statistics taken this millennium.  2001 on compared to 2000 and earlier shows a huge gap between these 'traumatic' experiences in gays and straights when you divy the ratio.

If anything - it's turning they have had more normal childhoods than we.
You know that dream?  The white picket family?  The good home style cookin'?

One day that'll be illegal in old thought countries - cause that produces more homosexuality than San Fransisco.

For you adult guys, it's easy to say that my 'try to not get dragged' statement are foolish and naive. but for growing up teenage like me, this is a little hard to control, Because our hormon are still unstable and we will likely to choose the wrong path in our life, for our minds are easily can be changed. That's the main reason i type that statement, to warn any teenage that come across this case to get hold on themself.

For the 'problems' part, i reffered to guys that became homosex because the reason no.1. We should help them if we can do it. But maybe the ignoring community lifestyle of this world will likely turned down my ideas.

 

[Ellie]

You don't need to warn people if something isn't bad or wrong... :/

That's like warning people not to eat carrots because they're healthy.

 

[bashful crobat]

For you adult guys, it's easy to say that my 'try to not get dragged' statement are foolish and naive. but for growing up teenage like me, this is a little hard to control, Because our hormon are still unstable and we will likely to choose the wrong path in our life, for our minds are easily can be changed. That's the main reason i type that statement, to warn any teenage that come across this case to get hold on themself.

I'm no adult. I'm a big ball of hair and gay; there's a difference. And it's unlikely that hormones alone will cause people to "choose the wrong path" |) unless there's a massive hormonal imbalance or there was an existing predisposition to "choosing the wrong path" |).

So is it wrong or not in your eyes? I kind of want to kick you for these HUGE GLARING INCONSISTENCIES in your opinions.

 

[Sic Semper Tyranosaurus]

Yup, i'm 16 years old kid with not so normal live to go... Meeting many people in my adolesence times and they're indirectly made my minds to became so mature before my age...

You seem to have made the assumption that I was complimenting you. This is incorrect.

For you adult guys, it's easy to say that my 'try to not get dragged' statement are foolish and naive. but for growing up teenage like me, this is a little hard to control, Because our hormon are still unstable and we will likely to choose the wrong path in our life, for our minds are easily can be changed. That's the main reason i type that statement, to warn any teenage that come across this case to get hold on themself.

If your hormones are telling you to hit on other guys, I suggest reevaluating your stance on homosexuality before you give yourself even more severe psychological issues than your naivety.

 

[WeAreSuperhero]

For you adult guys, it's easy to say that my 'try to not get dragged' statement are foolish and naive. but for growing up teenage like me, this is a little hard to control, Because our hormon are still unstable and we will likely to choose the wrong path in our life, for our minds are easily can be changed. That's the main reason i type that statement, to warn any teenage that come across this case to get hold on themself.

For the 'problems' part, i reffered to guys that became homosex because the reason no.1. We should help them if we can do it. But maybe the ignoring community lifestyle of this world will likely turned down my ideas.

Can you please elaborate on this please? I'm 16, and you're giving me and the rest of your age group a bad name. I'm sure theres so much I could pick apart in this post but I just cant read it properly. Can you sort out your grammer please? (Actually. Scratch that. I'm now 17, the clocks just clicked past 12 o'clock. Someone bake me a cake? =3)

To return to the original point of this conversation: As far as I know, it is impossible to 'cure' homosexuality, in as much as it is impossible to 'cure' blonde hair. You can get dyes, but thats not a permanent change. Even if there was some scientific value to these televangelist pills, which I seriously doubt, it would not cause a permenant change in someones sexuality.

 

[Rain]

To 'cure' homosexuality first of all you would have to categorize it as a disease, which it is most definitely not, it's a choice or a preference at best, like enjoying the taste of marmite or not. Shit, while we are at it why don't we try and cure the different races in the world and make everybody white? >_>

This is the kind of thing that really pisses me off, when ignorant people are given money and power to shout there stupid non fact based 'truths' from the rooftops when in fact they are the ones that need curing by either A) actually looking at things from a different point of view or B) accepting that they can't accept other people's differences but at least having the common respect and decency to shut the fuck up about it rather than try and change the world to how they see it should be.

In the UK at the moment we have this disgusting advertisement campaign which is basically giant billboards with red backgrounds and white font that just say "YEAH I'M GAY, SO WHAT?!" (Or something to that effect, I haven't seen one in a few days) is that supposed to be empowering to the homosexual community? I'm a straight male, and I found it offensive, not because it was directly targeting people of my orientation and challenging us as a whole to accept something we should by default, but because if I was homosexual I'd be fucking pissed about this, as it seems to only raise a problem (that at least from what I can see) seems to be less of an issue everyday and try and grab attention where it isn't needed or probably wanted, talk about salt in the wounds.

Now, I'm pretty damn tired and haven't exactly looked into this so this could all be a lot of bollocks or hearsay, but I'm pretty sure there is homosexuality within the animal kingdom, which if anything it shows it's just a natural part of our existence, as animals.

R

 

[t0nedef]

Look, I'm not going to say whether or not homosexuality is a disease, i'm not going to say whether or not it i can be cured. I'm just going to ask, why cure people of their happiness.

I mean seriously, if your straight and your neighbor's gay, so the fuck what. So he's plowing some other guys ass in his room. Does this affect you? If it does, I think you really need to look into seeing a doc to help you out with those self confidence issues that are lurking behind that shroud of homophobia. I look it like this, those two guys next door are having a good time, and they are happy, so who fucking cares. Let them be gay. What right do we have to invade in their lifestyle, tell them that they are wrong, and then put them through some sort of traumatic curing process basically saying... "Hey, you, you can't be happy!" I mean when it comes down to it, thats what it is. People seeing other people being happy with who they are and getting jealous. And i don't mean of the sex, i'm talking about the happiness that they receive from whatever bond they share.

I'm not saying that all gay's are happy. I'm just saying, that it's none of anybodies business how two guys or girls in the case of lesbians (didn't want y'all to think i was forgettin ya) choose to live their lives. If no one is getting hurt, we have no right to intervene. This shouldn't be compared to some man or woman being beaten by their signifigant other, as this is not the same thing at all.

You as a person have the right to love whoever you should choose, and nobody has the right to tell you that you can't love them. It's just wrong.


ok, i've said my piece.

 

[koopa-on-fire]

What annoys me is that I have friends who think gays have a choice to be homosexual. Citing Mr. Twig from South Park, "If we could choose who we loved, it would be much simpler but much less magical."

I know for a fact that I am straight, and I cannot get hard or feel love for other men because of this. However, I can to women. Yet homosexuals can become horny and/or fall in love with other people in the same gender. So it is obvious we do not have a choice over which gender or who we love, and it is natural instinct descendant from one's brain.

And if gays could be cured, would they want to? Would it be "cured" anyway? That would be like curing me of being Irish, or curing my friend of being Jewish, or curing my other friend of being obese. It's not really curing or healing, it's just a corrupt alias for blatant homophobia.

 

[Sic Semper Tyranosaurus]

or curing my other friend of being obese

Unless your friend has glandular problems (big bummer if he does  :down I don't think it's really an analog for curing something totally ingrained in the makeup of your being. Still, I know what you mean and agree entirely.

 

[LightAndMagic]

As a gay person, I felt like I would say my piece.

In all honesty, if there was a 'cure' for homsexuality as it could possibly be due to chromosomal or dna differencies, I would think about taking it. Why? It would make life so much easier.
I did not choose it. I've felt it ever since I can remember. It's a lot of stress, and the constant concern about who will still care for you despite the fact is frankly, annoying. But I'm tired of all the stupid bullshit arguments that homosexuality is a choice. I know it wasn't a choice for me. I also don't understand why someone would choose to be gay, it's not like there's any benefits to it.

Furthermore, this whole "we would become extinct!" theory is bullshit. Isn't the point of evolution to deal with the problems we have and adapt to them, so say men began to die off, leaving only women. Wouldn't women evolve as a species to reproduce without the use of men? It's the whole basis behind evolution, overcoming the problems surrounding us, and homosexuality could be one of them. There's already proof of homosexuality evolving and allowing for reproducing: http://www.nerve.com/Regulars/ScienceOf ... -19-00.asp

That's right, lesbian lizards reproducing.
Thank you evolution.

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

I know for a fact that I am straight, and I cannot get hard or feel love for other men because of this.

This comment and any argument that could back it up can be shattered with three simple rules.
1) there is no such thing as never.
2) trapped spaces (prison/desertion) can do wonders to change your libido
3) rules 1 and 2 are absolute

-
Light and Magic,
No there is no guarantee that women would suddenly turn asexual.
Sure it's a possibility, and I know we're not talking men dying off within one hundred years - but even if it was a long drawn out thing that fits into a evolution nest egg theory, it's still not a promise.
Evolution does hit dead ends.

Lizards are not humans.  You can not compare there systems to ours.  That's like saying we will evolve to regenerate lost limbs if we continually cut our thumbs off every generation.  Well no it's not.
But people living surrounded by water where their likelihood to drown doesn't mean they'd grow gills or we'd have some freaky people in the Amazon.  I could show you a mudskipper thing that breaths air and water - but the parallel isn't concrete.

But yes.
The extinction argument is complete bullshit that has no end.

 

[Sic Semper Tyranosaurus]

Furthermore, this whole "we would become extinct!" theory is bullshit. Isn't the point of evolution to deal with the problems we have and adapt to them, so say men began to die off, leaving only women. Wouldn't women evolve as a species to reproduce without the use of men? It's the whole basis behind evolution, overcoming the problems surrounding us, and homosexuality could be one of them. There's already proof of homosexuality evolving and allowing for reproducing: http://www.nerve.com/Regulars/ScienceOf ... -19-00.asp

Evolution does not work that way. If all the males of a species suddenly die out (suddenly can mean THOUSANDS of YEARS) the species is doomed. You don't just go POOF no more dudes, and get females that can produce with one another if they had no reason to do so previously.

In all honesty, if there was a 'cure' for homsexuality as it could possibly be due to chromosomal or dna differencies, I would think about taking it. Why? It would make life so much easier.

This is very sad.  I think this demonstrates very well that someone would never make the choice to be gay. It's hard, and nobody in their right mind wants life to be that hard just to Stick it to the Man.

 

[LightAndMagic]

While that is very true sixty, I was just providing an alternative. People consistently point out evolution as against homosexuality when it doesn't necessarily have to be so.
Besides, I just think the whole lesbian lizards is an incredibly interesting scientific case that I thought would be fun to share.

 

[Ellie]

As the male population got less and less, women would evolve to have more offspring per intercourse, i.e. produce more eggs, or something like that, growing less and less dependant on men for offspring, etc. It wouldn't just be "hmm, no men, I'll just evolve", it'd take thousands of years. But eventually something would happen. But would us dying out be a bad thing? I mean... how many species have we killed off?

 

[___]

You guys are missing something big here.  Men and women are not two different species.  An increase in the rate of homosexuality in males would not result in a decrease in the number of males compared to females.  The birth rate of male - female children would remain constant.  If somehow, despite not reproducing, the homosexual gene, if such a thing exists, kept getting passed on by way of heterosexual couplings or by way of artificial insemination and surrogate mothers, it would have no impact whatsoever on the male->female ratio.

More likely than anything if homosexual men stopped participating in reproduction homosexuality in males would decline, assuming once again that it's genetic in nature.

Please, try to think critically.

 

[Legendary]

Um, women wouldn't evolve to start having more eggs, or learn how to trigger parthenogenesis (i think the term for only having one individual involved in producing offspring). Evolution works to state that those with the best adaptations will pass those adaptations onto the next generation. There is no mutation for being able to have kids by yourself, and it is doubtful one will develop. Therefore, if men stopped existing, and there weren't replenishable sperm banks, women would die out soon after, because evolution isn't a "Oh, I think I'll survive better if I had eyes," it's "Ooh, my light-sensitive cells give me an advantage, allowing me to have sex with more animals, and start making more eyes."