FF7

[candle]

First, I would ask the above two posters to refrain from voicing their fanboish opinions with out explanatons.

Second, VII's story seemed very convoluted and confusing to me as I played through the game. This was mostly due to its presentation. People here argue that the characters are well developed when in fact, they are merely two-dimensional for the most part. Most poeple seem to confuse sharacter history with character development. History is the backstory of the character while development is the subtle changes in their personality throughout the game. The only depth added to VII Sephiroth's change in goals. VI and IX had much more character development.

Do not get me wrong, I think VII was a good game, just not as good as most think. VI and IX are my favorites because of their characters and stories.

 

[Luminier]

Yay. I love how waby just necropsted this to declare his stupid fanboyishness.

While I'm here though, I would like to say that I don't like FFVII very much at all.

Well, initially, the first time I played through it, I had already known about the major plot twist, and ending, so the plot was pretty much ruined before I had even started.

The story was kind of weak, in my opinion, anyway. Although, my opinion may have skewed from knowing about the story, before I even played it.

I didn't much care for the characters, either. Cloud was... ugh. Cold, emotionless, but just a confused boy on the inside. Yawn. Didn't like him much. I did, however like Barret. Barret was just kick-ass, no explanation needed. Aerith, blah. Tifa was okay, but she was way too emotionally fragile. Yuffie was annoying. Cait Sith bugged the crap outta me. Red XIII was okay, too. Vincent was too gothic for my tastes, although guns are cool. Sephiroth? As Darkfire said, bishie fan-service. Plus, that sword is kinda... too big to be a plausible weapon.

The gameplay itself was okay, but I like the pacing in FFIX, much better. Equipping materia was cool, but I prefer games where party members have set roles in battle.

I'm not saying it's bad, but I didn't like it. Plus, everyone is so in love with it, and I don't like having Cloud, and Seph shoved down my throat at every turn. Give me FFIX, over FFVII any day! ^_^

 

[Skyla Doragono]

I think the primary problem with FF7 is that it was largely unfinished, as deadlines kept pushing the creators to take short cuts they really shouldn't have. You can see this if you browse though the game using a program called "JENOVA" and also using cheat codes via a Gameshark or other such tool. True, data that the programmers decided not to use gets left behind in games all the time, but the items and other things you see left in FF7 were left there because where you get them and the corresponding scenarios weren't finished and had to be abandoned for the sake of putting out a game that had something resembling a plot.

I'm not saying FF7 is a bad game. Far from it -- I personally enjoyed it, so did hundreds of thousands of other people out there -- but it's not as good as it could have been if everything had been finished the way the programmers originally wanted it to.

EDIT: I didn't even realize this was a necro-bumped thread. At least it sparked a small amount of discussion. :x

 

[Vampiriclayer]

i never played FF7 T_T

 

[Monk]

Lol Cloud was a whacko and will always strike me as one, he 's an imposter, a wannabee, there have been better spiky haired heros before him, and as for Seph, I feel everyone thinks he's to cool to look at his real story:
"C'mon mommie let's take over the world!" Lol thats the worst thing ever! Taking over the world with your dad is acceptable, but your mom? Who just made you your sack lunch!?

LMFAO

 

[waby]

i know alright which one of you smart guys reported me ff7 owns.

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

If you are going to randomly necropost a topic, at least stay on topic. Any reports made and any follow ups wouldn't have occurred had there been no useless near spamalicious necroposting.

But since we do now have this topic bumped, at least stay the course of the discussion. You know, possibly telling me why FF7 owns, because as far as I'm concerned that post was anoother pile of pure spam.

FF7 was a good game.
It just sucked in it's failure to do anything great.
I personally left with the impression it tried to be all these things, and tried to be special - and just fell short.

What's her name, the flower girl - her death was so anticlimactic for me (YES, I said it - you, okay you might've cried, but that don't mean I had to), that I actually got annoyed at the cutscene.
I guess that might be because I really never invested time into her when I didn't have to. It's like her whole persona was built on her meeting, and her death - and everything else was washed over as quickly as possible.
Cardboard generic store brand macaroni and cheese.
That's her personality. Chalky and full of vague things your not sure if you recognize.

The over all story seems nice, but it took forever to get there, left you hanging with absolutely nothing, and in the end you just kinda either accepted it or walked away.
If you accepted it - sure you might go raving about it, but still.

No depth.
Sephiroth was given uberness and never used it, he was a frigging joke of an opponent story wise because how many times in outside sources is he labeled the strongest entity in the FF7 world - and yet he never, once, ever uses his strength. Completely makes no sense and makes an insult.

See?
I didn't just say "FF7 sucks but it's okay" - I gave opinions, try it some time.

 

[Cruelty]

God you guys realy dont know anything do you all ffs are good accept after 10 there crap uterly and kingdom hearts was a good game so don't you dare call final fantasy you scumbag you don't know anything about rpgs if thats what you think.

i lol'd


FF9 is better than FF7 is every way possible. that is why i dislike ff7.

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

FF9 was so underrated.
Sure it went back to the early days of the FF series and lost almost everything post 6 that had seemed to become - or looked like it would - a mainstay, but it kept every good improvement made over the basics, and then some.
For the period of which it was released I'd call 9 the third best FF# game ever. Behind 6, which is also behind 4 (my personal best).

 

[DJ Jack]

FF9 was definitely underrated. I mean, the medieval setting and the likes is pretty bad ass. I prefer medieval over Sci-Fi and Modern any day. Because you could come up with a few better ideas and plots and that aren't able to be done in Sci-Fi. FF9 really needs to be appreciated more. I thought it was better than FF7. Seven was nice, but idk, it didn't hook on to me as much as 9 did. (I beat 9 like 6 times)

 

[Celesinator]

FFIV, VI, and IX are my favorites. I think IV is when FF began, though. I mean, VI is my all time favorite, but IV changed many things. It gave FF an actual story, Characters with themes, sort of a bad guy. Betral, death, love, hate, all of those. FFVII didn't start those. Who died who was in the party before hand? Not Aerith. FFVII, to my beleif, did not revolutionize anything. If any FF did, it was IV and VI. IV for giving the series what it needed, VI for tying it together for the future games.

 

[Spoo]

In my opinion, FFX was the suckiest FF game of them all, with the exception of Auron, he kicked ass! But it was bad because Tidus was a pussy who got sucked into some alternate dimension and defeats, by god I can't get enough of this name, Sin (tee-hee!!) who turns out to be his father, and you can't forget about sex. Sex is way too overrated in rpg's of today, causing a ton of corny fan fiction with bad grammar, like this
Anywho, my top 5 FF games:
1.Final fantasy VII
2.Final fantasy VIII
3.Final fantasy II
4.Final fantasy IV
5.Final fantasy V

 

[Luminier]

Hey, Akinari, ever heard of spoilers? If I actually cared about FFX, then I'd be pretty pissed off at you, right now.

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

Heh I thought Tidus was great because he wasn't "oh look at me I'm a bad ass" or "oh look at me I don't care" or "oh look at me I'm a grown man with years of experience and I'll prattle on like a child because oohhh i jus dunno wha ta do "

That's going to be on topic in a moment, because honestly FF7 to me was cliche characters that all never progressed in the story of the game.

 

[Spoo]

I was kind of comparing FFX to FFVII, and sixtyandaquarter, how does Cloud not progress along with the story?

Spoiler: Minor Spoilers

Cloud reveals some of his history in SOLDIER with Sephiroth, which turns out to be a lie, and he was taking the place of Zack, does he not?

I think that in the FFVII sequels, it reveals more character history. Play Dirge of Cerberus, or maybe Crisis Core when it comes out(for the PSP btw). You find out more that way.

 

[Cruelty]

FF7's characters were ALL trying to be too 'cool'. they were all 'loners', all had some kind of troubled past, and BOO-BOO THE FUCKING DRAMA AERIS (or however the hell you spell that) DIED NOOOO **GRAMMY AWARD WIN

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

@Akinari
Show me the growth.

Spoiler: where is it?

Cloud acts one way.
We find out his entire persona is a lie.
He cats the exact same way.

Except for a small handful of scenes - and often then it's merely a line or two, he doesn't change at all. For such a 'great' character, there's a massive lose of scope and personification.

He doesn't resolve anything.

I mean, it took Advent Children to show his character change, ebb, and grow - and you can't count that since that isn't FF7 the game now is it?

Here's Cloud - his personality is moody and detached and his history is a blank.
Here's Cloud flower girl died and he's a liar. His personality is moody and detached and his history is still filled with blanks.

Good. We've fleshed out his history, we've given some depth to his character, but sadly we only did that to his past. The Cloud we're playing as still hasn't changed or grown.

It's not that I hate FF7 or Cloud.
It's just annoying when people talk about how 'great' the character was when every great reason to make a character great is 100% lacking in a definitive term.

Cecil from SNES' FF4 had the same guilt complexes they tried to push on Cloud.
He succeeded in growing, despite the limitations on what the SNES could do with it's memory as far as text and scenes go.
Kinda makes Cloud look even worse when SNES could get it right, and over 3/5ths the original script was thrown out over limitations.

 

[Renzokuken12]

Hey what about

:FF7 Dirge of Cerberus
or
:FF7 Before Crisis
or
:FF7 Crisis Core

come on to actually HATE the game you need to play these. You know the people i know don't like cloud very much maybe because of his attitude y'know like Squall the lone wolf they all like RENO i rekon he's pretty cool as well his personality and i'm also a fan of FF i liked FF7 it was pretty good y'know with the storyline but yea it was pretty cliche but whats the point every game is going to be like that somehow

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

No.
No.
No.
You can hate the game and never play those. Those aren't Final Fantasy VII. Those are in the series, but that's not -not- FF7.

That's like saying you can't dislike Disney Aladdin or the Genie from Disney Aladdin, unless you've watched the Return of Jafar, Aladdin and the King of Thieves, Mickey's House of Mouse. - including not just the series but also the various home release special videos, and played all three Kingdom Hearts to date in which the Genie appears.

By that setting, only the most die hard fanatics and big enough Disney fans to waste time buying and viewing every medium of Disney or some random would be allowed to dislike a character, episode, movie, scene, or anything else.

If you talk FF7 as a game - you talk FF7 as a game. You don't need to throw in other things, because it's not what you are talking about. FF7 isn't a great or a horrible game because of Dirge or the Crisis games, and certainly not because of Advent Children or Kingdom Hearts.

Besides, if they took the time to develop cloud as they did in Advent Children or Kingdom Hearts maybe I wouldn't think FF7's version of Cloud to be so dull.

 

[arcthemonkey]

Sixty, if you wanna say that Cloud acts the same way through the entire game, you must have played a different game than I did.

Spoiler

Let's put it this way - in the beginning of the game, Cloud is pretty much completely aloof. He doesn't care what the hell happens to anybody. Of course, he's also in the middle of a dissociative breakdown, having escaped the failure and tragedy in his past by subconsciously stealing the identity of his best friend. Even if we stop here, he is, if nothing else, a complex character already.

Of course, then he finds out that the guy who destroyed his entire life is still alive. This makes no sense. That guy got the hell killed right our of him. Cloud goes, at this point, from being motivated by money to being motivated by desire for revenge. Justice even.

Now, I'm not gonna go blow by blow through the entire story, but I think it's especially important for you to consider the changes that come over Cloud after his Mako poisoning, and his realization that his past is all a lie. Cloud does not finish the game being a heartless bastard. He doesn't finish the game confused and overcome with guilt. He doesn't finish the game dissociative and detached. His motivations don't change, really, but they are expounded. The person, however, does.

I really don't know what else to say. I like to compare the cloud on the train in the spiral tunnel, talking to barret about the planet, to the Cloud on the highwind, resolving to go all the way, no matter the price, to save the planet. He's got an identity disorder, but I don't think this has to do with it.