Vegetarianism: A new path

[lunarea]

Is there even going to be a place for a debate in this thread if every response is going to sum up to "You are a bad person that's killing animals because you bought and ate meat!"?

If so, I'd like to know beforehand so I can remove myself from the conversation, as it would be completely one-sided and pointless.

 

[Fallofthetyrant]

No one is accusing you and any other person.
It is only about realizing the facts and doing something for the future.

 

[Ratty524]

My personal view:

Vegetarianism can be pretty unhealthy, as meat is the BEST source of protein (better than the other alternatives). Animals are being slaughtered? I don't care, I like eating meat. If unhealthy breeding processes are used in "slaughtering" these animals, then I would care, since that affects MY health. In general, the only time I would ever convert to being a vegetarian is if for some, odd reason I can no longer digest meat products properly. That's my view on this subject.

 

[Fallofthetyrant]

But that's a pretty egoistic point of view (no offense intended) but it seems to me people got an individualist tendency to think about their own person, no matters what the consequences might be for the environment which inevitably we all share.

Don't you think about how nature might degrade in the next decades?

 

[lunarea]

Am I incapable of caring about environment and doing my share of getting rid of pollution if I'm not vegetarian?

Does the fact that I eat meat completely erase any other thing I do for the environment (such as riding a bike to work instead of a car, recycling, buying enviro-friendly products/services or donating to environmental causes and associations)?

 

[Fallofthetyrant]

No it doesn't, at all... But by eating meat you indirectly contribute with companies that are making money from it without thinking about the future.

Actually, everything you named are great actions that contribute a lot.

 

[Rye]

You know, if we care about animals and plants so much, we should all off ourselves. Mankind is horrible for the environment and as such, should all be dead.

So let's go off ourselves! Make the environment happy again!

 

[Fallofthetyrant]

Lol Rye... There's something called balance you know?

 

[Rye]

Who cares about balance? If you're so concerned for the environment and the animals, then the best thing is to be rid of humans and let nature take its course.

But seriously, I do have sympathy for the poor animals and how they are treated before they die. I've actually done my best to exclude most meat from my diet (though, since I still live at home, I cannot really have much say, as my whole family is against tofu and the other stuff.) I wish if we had to eat the animals, they were treated better. :\

 

[Fallofthetyrant]

I do wish the same, therefore the reason of this thread.

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

I'm not against vegetarian diets or life styles when it comes to completely not using any materials with animal products are parts. I'm not against people wanting to help the environment. And I'm all for a balance.

I think a balance of eating healthier would be the effective and healthy choice. I don't think cutting meat out of the diet will do much, suddenly we'll have what? Huge amounts of companies incredibly upping their chemical usages on fields next to towns with children and god knows where else. The sudden increases in less goodly communities abusing the richer vegetation stock in foreign and poorer countries - like we were doing with poultry and substitute meats here in the states until all these strange bacteria and viruses were popping up.

It's like saying, okay the environment would be better with a lower electricity usage, with less wires and pipelines running threw the world. With less possible electrical fires from exploding transformers and the like. So let's cut all electricity out of our lives, no more microwaves, computers, light bulbs, nothing that runs on electricity or produces the risk of problems from electricity. Squirrels live with out, we don't either.

I'm not against cutting back on meats and the way the industry cuts the crop with them, or the waste produced when certain companies destroy hundreds of animals for a very small yield. But things are changing thankfully. I'm equally for alternate forms of energy to replace electricity, something friendlier to the people and their lives and such, but cutting out either is a little extreme for the sake of...? No proof on either end that one is better than the other for our species - which is the only species that matters in the end.

 

[Marcus]

Vegetarian food leaves a deep impression on our nature. If the whole world adopts vegetarianism, it can change the destiny of humankind
Albert Einstein

For as long as men massacre animals, they will kill each other. Indeed, he who sows the seed of murder and pain cannot reap joy and love
Pythagoras (6th century BC)

Honestly, I think these quotes are pretty stupid. Way to go, Einstein! Literally!

I tried to go on a vegetarian diet... and I don't mean for a like a weak or something, but I seriously put off all meats, eggs, cheese, milk, fish, (I was going straight up VEGAN) for almost a year before I finally realized... this ain't doing crap for me.

I did it for health reasons (I was a fatty) and excercised at the same pace during my omnivorous diet, but I was still pretty overweight, the only weight I had lost was precious muscle, and I was popping supplements so much that it felt like my liver was stabbing itself out of pure agony. I ate a 1lb hamburger at Fudrucker's the next day and INSTANTLY felt rejuvinized!

Simple fact, humans are omnivorous. Yeah, we can survive on plants, but it is an undisputable fact that we require more nutrients and vitamins than any other creatures because are bodies are incredibly complex. There are proteins, amino acids, and minerals that can't be supplemented or supplemented well and meat also enriches your blood and stimulates your salival glands for stronger enzymes and better digestion.

We're animals, fellahs. We're dominant animals of prey. Like the mighty lion, we devour both meat and grass. We were given canine teeth and incisors for a reason; to render and tear flesh. It's a mixture of both plants and meat that keeps us healthy. Like Maynard brought up a good point in his skit Disgustipated

"And the vegetables cried out for it was harvest season and the holocaust to them!"

Life feeds on life, feeds on life, feeds on life, feeds on life. THIS IS NECESSARY.

If it's against your religion or faith to eat meat... then I deeply feel for you. I'm a protestant and the bible says take what you want from the flock so long as you do not waste and frankly, I never waste good food.

 

[Fallofthetyrant]

I've been vegetarian for years and I'm in perfect health and condition. I don't see how can vegetarianism be bad at all.

 

[lunarea]

A friend of mine had to give up her vegan diet when she got pregnant because despite the prenatal vitamins and over-the-counter supplements (such as Tums), she had a very high calcium deficiency. She also had borderline gestational diabetes which she regulated with a diet (rather than insulin). This meant a more rigid diet that consisted mostly of protein - which was easiest to get in the form of meat and dairy products.

She had a fantastic doctor who tried to help her keep her vegan diet. She had a supportive network of friends.

But the end result was that no matter how hard she tried, she had to change her lifestyle. To pursue her vegan diet would have put her child in danger and given to complications during birth.

I'm not bringing this up to say that vegetarianism or veganism are bad, but to show that there are certain (albeit specific) situations where it's not healthy for a person to refuse to include meat & dairy in their diet.

 

[Fallofthetyrant]

Concerning that point you are right, pregnancy and vegetarianism don't get along well.

 

[LosAngeles]

I'm a protestant and the bible says take what you want from the flock so long as you do not waste and frankly, I never waste good food.

Good attitude here, but(it's a bit off topic) have you thought about the 6th Commandment?("Thou shalt not murder")
Conventions and habits are the basis to justify killing animals by humans. Enemies are destroyed and people are celebrating the victors in times of war and even in times of peace people are fated to die without moral concerns.
What was forbidden a long time ago is now acceptable and vice versa.
It's just an interesting point I think...

Life feeds on life, feeds on life, feeds on life, feeds on life.

It does! The hunting/killing of animals by humans is a process from the stone age, but back then it was equatibly. Now animals are opressed and many extincted(for research purpuses of course!).

Who cares about balance? If you're so concerned for the environment and the animals, then the best thing is to be rid of humans and let nature take its course.

Well balance is important and the humans do influence this balance to it's extremest and is now more co-existing with(or even ruling?) nature rather than being part of it, because as a high evolved creature humans have a single status. But they're a creature of nature, just as animals and plants, which means they're equal.
(I could add that eating meat is like cannibalism, but that's too exaggerated...)
Mankind won't be taken away, so instead humans have to find a way back to nature.

I don't think that anyone will be convinced here to become a vegetaian(it would be awesome though), but it's good to see that the advantages of vegetarism are shown, awareness is created, so people question theirselves more nature and what's their point toward it is.

 

[Diedrupo]

Good attitude here, but(it's a bit off topic) have you thought about the 6th Commandment?("Thou shalt not murder")
Conventions and habits are the basis to justify killing animals by humans. Enemies are destroyed and people are celebrating the victors in times of war and even in times of peace people are fated to die without moral concerns.
What was forbidden a long time ago is now acceptable and vice versa.
It's just an interesting point I think...

The 6th commandment does not in any way apply to animals. The Jewish people at the time the commandments were supposedly given out/written were happily slaughtering cows, sheep, and quail for food, and it is pretty damn obvious that they did not stop the practice because of the 10 commandments.

Fast forward to the New testament and read the story about the kid who slaughtered his pet lamb to make a tasty meal for Jesus. Mmm, lamb!

Humans regardless of culture have been hunting and eating animals for THOUSANDS of years. It's not going to stop now.

I don't think that anyone will be convinced here to become a vegetaian(it would be awesome though), but it's good to see that the advantages of vegetarism are shown, awareness is created, so people question theirselves more nature and what's their point toward it is.

I think primarily vegetarian diets are sensible, but swearing off all meat because you don't want to hurt animals is silly. Eating the ocassional turkey or fish won't freakin' hurt you or anyone.

 

[PeteD2S]

I am agaisn't all forms of unecessary torture and sport killing, but I don't mind killing an animal for food, that is as necessary as breathing. Telling me I am doing bad stuff to nature is pure stupidness, there are many carnivore animals that kill their preys in painfuly ways and you are not yelling at them because of that. It's life, live with that.

 

[coloratura]

I believe humans were meant to omnivorous. At one point, we were probably mostly carnivorous. Have you seen the dentitions of ancient hominids? Huge canines. Our current mixed dentition, of flat molars AND canines (albeit smaller) point towards the fact we omnivorous. Humans can actually survive effectively either way. (Studies have been done on groups across the world that are either most carnivorous or mostly herbivorous, and both were equally as healthy. Yet, take into mind, those that ate mostly meat were able to eat it and still be healthy because they have a very high calorie diet due to the level of activity it takes to hunt.)

In my opinion, we do need to eat meat - but modern cultures eat way too much of it considering our activity levels. We don't need as much meat as we think we do.

Also, what about the pet food industry? What if a vegetarian has a pet cat? What would they feed it, considering meat is against their morals? Cats cannot digest or receive any nutrition from carbohydrates - every part of their physiology points towards getting their nutrients from meat. How would the vegetarian feed their cat? Wouldn't denying a cat meat, what it's meant to in nature, inhumane?

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

An ex was a vegetarian and had actually had a snake that did eat mice. The feeling was humans shouldn't, and don't have to - but can if they must. A snake has to, and must be able to. Thus, she can eat her greens, and the snake could have Minnie. And her conscience would somehow stay clean.