Religion, what do you think?

[Incognitus]

I believe that Heaven is a place that occupies space, just as Earth does. Only Heaven is imaginably far away.

So if you had a very powerful telescope - I assume you do believe in telescopes- you'd be able to see him?

 

[jacob]

No, for a couple reasons.

1) God cannot be seen by impure human eyes. (See: Moses talking to God, Mount of Transfiguration, etc) These were instances were God was able to talk to people that were temporarily transfigured to be able to withstand His presence.

2) God would not allow a telescope that powerful to be built (assuming it is possible) (See: The Tower of Babil--some early inhabitants of the Earth wanted to build a tower to reach Heaven (obviously not possible, but to them, it was (somewhat like how for you, making a powerful telescope is possible (okay I need to stop using parenthesis))) and God stopped their progress by confusing their tongues.)

 

[Incognitus]

Oh. Well thank god you cleared that up.

I was worried that we might look through this telescope and discover that god was Xenu. And that would have made people like you look silly.

 

[mawk]

god is dead

nietzche was a firm believer in the concept of the holy ghost

 

[QuantumMindGames]

I believe that Heaven is a place that occupies space, just as Earth does. Only Heaven is imaginably far away.

i heard that heaven was smaller than the size of a grain of rice... quantum phsyics, anyone?

better start learning how the subatomic world works, else you might die before you find heaven! :P

 

[mawk]

i heard that heaven was smaller than the size of a grain of rice... quantum phsyics, anyone?

better start learning how the subatomic world works, else you might die before you find heaven! :P

the fuck is this

 

[QuantumMindGames]

i heard that heaven was smaller than the size of a grain of rice... quantum phsyics, anyone?

better start learning how the subatomic world works, else you might die before you find heaven! :P

the fuck is this

some crazy theory i heard about heaven being smaller than the size of a grain of rice... and that quantum phsyics might lead to the discovery of a tangible god. spouted out by a self-proclaimed christian saying he found this quote in the bible, and then speeling babble after.


and no, i dont actually believe this lol.

 

[mawk]

no I mean the second part

why do you even bring quantum physics up here I just

jesus christ this is the worst topic ever. there are basically three people on this forum who know enough to discuss religion well.

 

[QuantumMindGames]

no I mean the second part

why do you even bring quantum physics up here I just

jesus christ this is the worst topic ever. there are basically three people on this forum who know enough to discuss religion well.

calm down, it was a corny joke.


and doesn't that very statement say that a majority of people don't know their religion correctly?


or if you want an explanation to why this is, it's how people look at this stuff, and it doesn't make it fact. same thing with religion. it's what you think of the world and all the spiritual stuff about it. does it make it right or wrong? no. it's what you see and you think.

 

[mawk]

calm down, it was a corny joke.

joke better.

and doesn't that very statement say that a majority of people don't know their religion correctly?

they don't. that's all of what I'm saying.

there are like three people on this forum who understand much of anything and they're not posting here often enough to balance things out.

btw "understand" doesn't mean "have bible passages on hand to quote during an argument"

 

[Diaforetikos]

How can you argue religion from a scientific or logical standpoint when its not logical or scientific?

 

[mawk]

I'm not asking anyone to do either of those things.

 

[Diaforetikos]

Then how do you expect someone to argue religion without facts. And since religions only so called facts are from the bible, and the bible doesn't technically contain facts, how do you argue something that doesn't have any facts? This debate is void and won't go anywhere if that is the case.

 

[mawk]

how are you picking this shit up? I'm asking that people understand their religion and religions in general before making assertions about them. I don't care if you use facts or wild guesses or divine your answers from tea. I don't care what you use to support your reasoning so long as the reasoning seems reasonable. I'm just tired of nearly everyone who posts in this thread talking out their ass.

faith necessitates a lack of facts, yeah. I'm not arguing that. all I know is that reading a lot of the reasoning here makes me cringe. I don't care what people say as long as they have a good reason to think it. I'd defend Hitler if the guy taking the anti-Hitler standpoint was using stupid reasoning. from what I'm reading, a lot of people get their religion entirely from the pamphlets in the foyers of their places of worship, and that's just a pathetic way to experience your religion.

 

[Diaforetikos]

Well its hard to have a reasonable reason when the way I got into mine was a completely different experience than anyone else. Its person. You can't explain it and assume my same feelings will reach you and you'll understand what I mean. When people decide to have religion in their lives, its usually never the same as the person next to them. I can't debate my feelings of how I accepted my religion. It's completely personal. So in order for me to have a valuable reason for you to see why religion is important, you would have to take part in it all on your own. It won't mean the same thing to someone if its forced on you. Here are logical and rational reasons why I believe religion is good. But it isn't logical. It won't make sense unless you find out for yourself. So in this case, its still a void debate.

 

[dadevvtsvre]

This entire topic is pretty much void now.

 

[bashful crobat]

This entire topic was pretty much void from the get-go, to be fair.

 

[Cruelty]

i'll necroquote because of the de-railing of this topic. :\

Funny how to the people so involved in their religions, that when someone of another faith or no faith tells them their beliefs, they are astonished, and look at them as poor pathetic souls. and if an argument heats up, its always "you are wrong, i am right" on both sides.


When will people realize that it's how you look at life? its your perspective on the world, how things work and the explanation behind things otherwise unexplainable. There is no right or wrong, its what you believe. Why is no religion considered the right religion? Maybe because it's impossible to do so - since it's nothing but a belief structure.


"A building without a solid structure will fall when something comes along and gives it the right push."
This is the reason for religion, or for some people no religion. There is no right religion, period. There is no wrong religion, either. Some are considered immoral, yes. But to the people who actively pursue these faiths, it's real, and it's how the world works.


I kinda make it a personal goal to help let people realize this that are too blinded by their own perspective. It's what you believe in and how you see the world.


Oh, and I'm buddhist, and technically it's not even a religion - it's a way of life. peace and whatnot.

ironically, that's just your perspective.

also the buddhist belief is that there IS that one true nature of the universe, and that when it is truly understood, you reach nirvana and all that. but you're saying there isn't, it's all how you look at things, and that the universe is unexplainable. I'm wondering how you can be a buddhist and believe the other things you said in that post?

 

[R.J.]

No, I don't have a religion. My parents are christians, and they tried to get me into church for a while, but it just doesn't work for me.

It's very simple, if there's a god, why do we live in such a disgusting world. Everyday people are killed, murdered, robbed, raped, molested, tortured, etc. If god had any kind of respect for his creations he'd do something about it.

Also, going to heaven after death just seems like a nice illusion for people who are afraid to die, and think they will end up in some better place.

Not trying to offend peoples with religion, but that's how I think about it.

 

[jacob]

It's very simple, if there's a god, why do we live in such a disgusting world. Everyday people are killed, murdered, robbed, raped, molested, tortured, etc. If god had any kind of respect for his creations he'd do something about it.

That's a fairly common doubt. Let me share with you one of my favorite passages of scripture that helps explain this.

Years before the birth of the Christ, there were two priests named Alma and Amulek preaching the gospel. A corrupt ruler, jealous that the people adored God and not him, ordered everyone to stop praying and stop believing. When they continued to do so, he started to kill all the believers--even women and little children, and he had Alma and Amulek witness their deaths:

10 And when Amulek saw the pains of the women and children who were consuming in the fire, he also was pained; and he said unto Alma: How can we witness this awful scene? Therefore let us stretch forth our hands, and exercise the power of God which is in us, and save them from the flames.
11 But Alma said unto him: The Spirit constraineth me that I must not stretch forth mine hand; for behold the Lord receiveth them up unto himself, in glory; and he doth suffer that they may do this thing, or that the people may do this thing unto them, according to the hardness of their hearts, that the judgments which he shall exercise upon them in his wrath may be just; and the blood of the innocent shall stand as a witness against them, yea, and cry mightily against them at the last day.

Just about every Christian faith recognizes that we are here on this Earth to be tested. (Actually, all of them that I am familiar with) We have been given the gift of free agency, meaning we can choose good or evil, for ourselves. Part of our experience on this Earth is to suffer. It is necessary to experience the bad to appreciate the good. And it is necessary for God to let people make their own decisions (even if that means costing the lives of innocents) in order for his judgements to be just.

Were God to intervene, there would be no "good" people (due to lack of bad people), there would be no "happiness" (due to lack of suffering) and there would be no progression (due to lack of decision making)

So we needn't think that because good people suffer on this Earth, God doesn't love them or doesn't care. On the contrary, He is allowing the bad people to seal their testimony with innocent blood so that there can be justice.

13 For the Lord suffereth the righteous to be slain that his justice and judgment may come upon the wicked; therefore ye need not suppose that the righteous are lost because they are slain; but behold, they do enter into the rest of the Lord their God.