Feminism

[Daxis]

Twirly, the fact the courts decided 55k a month was a good amount leads me to believe he has little if any custody of that child. The less you see the kid, generally the more you end up paying out.

no court can believe that 55k a month is a good amount. that's ridiculous. People do it all the time, doesn't mean they should shell out more than what my parents make in a year.
nah, just make it so that the top amount can be 3600 dollars, THE AVERAGE american income. why would you need more than that? it's ridiculous. Unless it's to actually PUNISH the parent, there is NO reason to do so. for divorcees and shit that don't have 3600, then just make them pay accordingly less.
if you want to actually punish the parent, instead of giving 55k to a single person in custody, then just actually say it's a punishment and make him pay the 51400 thousand to other parents that need it. share the wealth, so to speak.

 

[Twirly]

Twirly, the fact the courts decided 55k a month was a good amount leads me to believe he has little if any custody of that child. The less you see the kid, generally the more you end up paying out. Is there a reason you're being so hostile? Did your daddy get charged a heap that your mom smoked up in a pipe or something? I really don't get it. I don't understand where your self-righteous rage comes from.

Same goes for saukrates. Do you have mommy issues too? I don't understand why you're raging all over the place.

I'm going to leave this topic because it's quite clear that the few who have inferiority complexes and insecurity issues can shout over the rest, but I'll leave with this. Perhaps you're so angry because you do in fact feel inferior to strong women, and that it has much more to do with your own insecurities than it has to do with feminism, equality, and the fight women have to put up to play on even ground.

It's funny as fuck because no my daddy didn't get charged or anything he still lives with my mom, therefore I am probably less biased toward this than some girl who got raped by a guy and ended up getting pregnant. (See, you had to make such a dumb remark so this is what you get).

 

[Sauk]

Twirly, the fact the courts decided 55k a month was a good amount leads me to believe he has little if any custody of that child. The less you see the kid, generally the more you end up paying out. Is there a reason you're being so hostile? Did your daddy get charged a heap that your mom smoked up in a pipe or something? I really don't get it. I don't understand where your self-righteous rage comes from.

Same goes for saukrates. Do you have mommy issues too? I don't understand why you're raging all over the place.

I'm going to leave this topic because it's quite clear that the few who have inferiority complexes and insecurity issues can shout over the rest, but I'll leave with this. Perhaps you're so angry because you do in fact feel inferior to strong women, and that it has much more to do with your own insecurities than it has to do with feminism, equality, and the fight women have to put up to play on even ground.

If you knew how to read, you'd understand why I lost it with him. I wasn't raging at all until he made dumb ass remarks and TOLD ME how I was feeling and completely mis-interpreted everything that I had said.

Don't ask me if I have mommy issues, since I live with my mom and love my mom, you arrogant imbecile. I love how you point the finger and claim that we have inferiority complexes like you're superior to us, lawl. I also love how you make jokes about Twirly's mom smoking crack and all this other shit, you fucking goof. Sorry for " raging " again, but you sound like a pompous asshole, and should really get an attitude adjustment. I wouldn't have flipped shit on buddy had he not claimed everything he had claimed, told me how I was feeling, mis-interpreted everything I had said and actually understood what was going on ITT.

" Perhaps you're so angry because you do in fact feel inferior to strong women, and that it has much more to do with your own insecurities than it has to do with feminism, equality, and the fight women have to put up to play on even ground. "

No, I really don't. If a woman can hold a job and her own? Good for her, idgaf. She's a fucking adult, she should be able to. I've explained countless amounts of times what I meant by Feminism being full of superiority complexes but it seems that white knights such as you and mundane don't want to interpret fuck all correctly and hop to conclusions, especially with claiming that I'm completely trashing all women. I've explained that the title was pertaining to all these NuFeminists who claim to be feminists and support womens rights and shit and who are the same people who don't go to any rally's / protests etc. Basically what the question was asking was Is feminism now becoming more about superiority based on the vast majority of fake supporters who abuse womens rights and demand more and more and more with as many perks as they can grab?

Of course, the poor damsel is in distress and a man has to rush to the aid to protect the woman, regardless of if the situation calls for it or not.

 

[Arcanum]

I think the concept that women who are bitches "abuse women's rights" is flawed. That implies that they don't deserve them from the outset, that they had to earn them, which in my opinion is certainly a misogynistic viewpoint. The way I see it, everyone should be treated as an equal from the get go, and if they cause trouble and are a disrespectful person, then they can be called out for it (and not by even discussing their gender because honestly that has nothing to do with whether you are an asshole. I know it is anecdotal evidence but my experience tells me that there are about equally as many terrible men as terrible women). But do you ever see a man who is a terrible person in similar ways being called out for "abusing men's rights"? Not usually. It is for this reason that I think feminism is certainly still a valid viewpoint, because until the discussion of women being bitches is not related to them being women, men and women aren't going to be equal.

Feminism being represented by those who seek superiority is not legitimate feminism and most feminists I know that are decent people call those people out for it and don't want anything to do with them.

 

[Sauk]

I think the concept that women who are bitches "abuse women's rights" is flawed. That implies that they don't deserve them from the outset, that they had to earn them, which in my opinion is certainly a misogynistic viewpoint. The way I see it, everyone should be treated as an equal from the get go, and if they cause trouble and are a disrespectful person, then they can be called out for it (and not by even discussing their gender because honestly that has nothing to do with whether you are an asshole. I know it is anecdotal evidence but my experience tells me that there are about equally as many terrible men as terrible women). But do you ever see a man who is a terrible person in similar ways being called out for "abusing men's rights"? Not usually. It is for this reason that I think feminism is certainly still a valid viewpoint, because until the discussion of women being bitches is not related to them being women, men and women aren't going to be equal.

Feminism being represented by those who seek superiority is not legitimate feminism and most feminists I know that are decent people call those people out for it and don't want anything to do with them.

I've stated already that I wasn't calling all women bitches, but women who do a list of things that makes them bad people gets them labelled as bitches, just like how men who do asshole things that most people would be repulsed at the thought of doing are labelled as dicks. I didn't mean to say that they never deserved the same rights as other humans, I just didn't know how to explain my point properly and used that as kind of a fill in until I could gather my thoughts properly. Also, I've never stated that bitch attitudes are all relative to all women, I've just experienced more women suffering from Princess Syndrome and see similar traits flowing through other women's personalities ( I'd like to add that when I say similar traits, I mean to a certain degree and not exactly the degree that one has. EX: My one friend expected her boyfriend to pay for the date and the meal etc, while this other girl wouldn't get verbal and bitchy, however, she always expected me to buy her fries and would get mildly upset if I didn't ).

The point of "Feminism being represented by those who seek superiority is not legitimate feminism and most feminists I know that are decent people call those people out for it and don't want anything to do with them." was exactly what I was trying to get across, and how in a sense they're abusing true Feminists hard work by tainting it and making it seem like something that is unreasonable and irrational.

 

[Arcanum]

I think the entire premise of this debate is focused on the belief that women being terrible is somehow are more of an issue than men doing so, and since anecdotal evidence is everywhere in this debate, I know an equal number of both genders who are assholes. Effectively, I think the whole argument is based on a flawed premise. But ah well.

Not to say that either gender is to blame for this sort of behavior, but men are also very much guilty of having the same sort of cultural expectations of women, a "male entitlement syndrome" if you will. I know it isn't an exact analogy, but the same way some women expect men to pay for their food at restaurants, men expect women to be sexually submissive or follow certain behaviors in relationships, which is a less overt, but still relevant cultural expectation. It goes both ways.

My personal experience with women is that often, when I offer to pay for food (simply because I consider myself a nice person, not because the person is a woman. I offer to pay for food for my guy friends as well), they often decline and want to pay for it themselves, because they want to be equal. Maybe I just happen to know a bunch of fabulous people, or something. But I think a lot of gender entitlement comes from feeling as if some social need isn't being met, and if those needs are met, the entitlement often disappears.

Anyhow, I think you should perhaps change the topic title to something more subject appropriate. You could say "Discuss: women waving the banner of feminism as an excuse to be assholes" or something along those lines. Because, at least to me, feminism as a concept is always going to be about equality, and thus the topic title is misleading.

 

[Sauk]

I think the entire premise of this debate is focused on the belief that women being terrible is somehow are more of an issue than men doing so, and since anecdotal evidence is everywhere in this debate, I know an equal number of both genders who are assholes. Effectively, I think the whole argument is based on a flawed premise. But ah well.

Not to say that either gender is to blame for this sort of behavior, but men are also very much guilty of having the same sort of cultural expectations of women, a "male entitlement syndrome" if you will. I know it isn't an exact analogy, but the same way some women expect men to pay for their food at restaurants, men expect women to be sexually submissive or follow certain behaviors in relationships, which is a less overt, but still relevant cultural expectation. It goes both ways.

My personal experience with women is that often, when I offer to pay for food (simply because I consider myself a nice person, not because the person is a woman. I offer to pay for food for my guy friends as well), they often decline and want to pay for it themselves, because they want to be equal. Maybe I just happen to know a bunch of fabulous people, or something. But I think a lot of gender entitlement comes from feeling as if some social need isn't being met, and if those needs are met, the entitlement often disappears.

Anyhow, I think you should perhaps change the topic title to something more subject appropriate. You could say "Discuss: women waving the banner of feminism as an excuse to be assholes" or something along those lines. Because, at least to me, feminism as a concept is always going to be about equality, and thus the topic title is misleading.

It's not that it's more of an issue, and I'm not saying that men's assholish behaviours are somehow justified / more right ( I don't mention men being dix because I'm not talking about men being dix, it doesn't mean that I don't and won't acknowledge that men are just as bad ), the issue seems to be extremely over-looked / argued in a woman's favour ( See: Mundane disregarding evidence of women abusing their spouse because to him they are Queens and Saints, and accusing me of sexism when he's just as sexist as I am for believing that women can do no harm ).

When a guy does something terrible to a woman, he's seen as an asshole. When a girl does something bitchy to a guy, it's normally over-looked because he probably deserved it ( Take the spitting scenario for example, she thought it was hilarious that she spat in his hair, but when he went to spit back her boyfriend said " Don't even think about it " and she got mad at him for wanting to retaliate. ) I know that's an isolated incident, but it's the only way I can explain my point without making zero sense.

I will change the tread title, however, because the arguments, white knight comments, and childish posts ( which I too am guilty of ) were not what I had hoped to see ITT.

Thank you for disagreeing with me and actually being civil about it instead of making accusations about my character.

 

[Eventing_Guy]

One thing I tell people in any sensitive topic such as this is

- There is always an exception...

So based on current thread title... I would say YES
Some woman wave the Femanist flag specifically to be Bithes.

If Equality were set up like a buffet, these type of woman would ONLY pick good things about equality and save F*** it to anything bad, rather then take everything to be completely EQUAL with others.

BUT that doesn't mean all woman are like that.

 

[bacon]

guys cut the argumentative shit if it goes on im locking this up and that is that

I dont mind civil arguments but the whole "did you have mommy issues?" or "you're retarded" or other obvious attacks are unacceptable and again, if anyone does it anymore this thread will be locked and the perpetrator will receive a warning

 

[BlueScope]

I think the concept that women who are bitches "abuse women's rights" is flawed. That implies that they don't deserve them from the outset, that they had to earn them, which in my opinion is certainly a misogynistic viewpoint.

While that is basically right, I think the point is more that there is rights that seem to apply especially to women... talking about insulting, physical violence, sexual harassment.
So, don't get me wrong here... I definately want men and women to have equal rights, but there shouldn't be something as "women rights", because no gender deserves more rights than another, especially if they're based on something totally gender-unrelated (in a biological sense) such as insulting.


To the whole Saukrates/Mundane/Lyric/Daxis thing... I've said it earlier in this thread - everyone can only be as objective as subjectively possible. Or, in other words, whatever someone says is obviously according to his or her own impressions up to this point in time. Even if they put it in a manner that suggest they want to apply it to each and every person on the planet, that's most likely not what they were trying to say, even if they didn't realize that while posting because they weren't aware there's grammar police out there, taking their sentences apart.

That being said, 55000 bucks is obviously something a smart lawyer figured out for the benefit of the girl... sounds like some law says that you can ask for that many percent of one's income, and due to a high income (that Nas guy is a musician, right?), a high percentage value came out in the end, which was juristically justified, however rationally totally pointless. Whoever actually thinks that you might need that amount (such as Lyric, who seemed to have a reasonable explanation for it) should think about if it's smart to give custody to a woman in the first place that needs 55000 dollars a month to raise a child. That much money you only need if you want to give him a special forces training all in the own backyard.


For the sake of getting back on the original idea of the topic, let's throw something else in here... I dunno if you guys have that in the US or whereever else you might live, but in Germany, we got "women parking only" and "mother and child parking only". I wonder what you guys think of that, as personally, I'm having trouble looking for a logical explanation that puts women in the need of their very own parking spots. I know it's supposed to protect women from getting molested by the evil men, but seriously... that is in my eyes a heavy case of sexism. Yes, women are less strong constructed as men, so far I follow. However for some reason, I know a few girls who'd have no trouble fighting off bigger and buffer fellas than themselves. I also know men who couldn't defend themselves against them. So, why wouldn't they be "weak fellas parking only"?
As for "mother and child parking", that's probably the even more aggrivating one... for WHATEVER reason do female parents deserve the sports next to the entrance of whatever place more than male parents do? This clearly can't be a matter of strong vs. weak, as you're always in a vulnerable position in the event of getting attacked when you have a child with you. So seriously, someone give me a reason please.
By the way... noone ever kept me from parking on those spots all day long, and I'll have a lot of fun discussing it with whoever will try to get me moving.


@bacon: Locking a threat because some can't discuss reasonably doesn't seem like a cool move to me... it's an interesting core discussion, so if you're unhappy about what's being said at the edges of that (which is where I agree with you), do something about that, not about the core.

 

[Sauk]

dead thread seems dead

 

[AimlessZealot]

I've read a good bit of this thread and figure I'll throw in my two cents.

I have been slapped by a girl and immediately backhanded her back. When I was growing up, my mother (who described herself as a feminist) sat me down and told me "If a girl feels big enough to step up to you, she's big enough to be put the **** down." That has always been my guiding light in relation to this issue.
A lot of people will point to lack of physical muscle mass as a reason why females should be in a protected category. I don't hold with this. I ask myself three questions:

1) Should a person have the right to fight for what they believe in?
1A) Yes.

2) Should a person have the right to defend themselves?
2A) Yes.

3) If you know you are weaker than someone is it your responsibility to avoid instigating a losing fight?
3A) Yes.

These seem very obvious to me. I would not knowingly pick a fight with someone that I knew would win... if I did, I have accepted the risk and deserve whatever comes. I personally do not fight often. I'm not an angry person and I don't "look" for fights. As a result, if a woman does something which I would strike a man for, I feel -obligated- to strike a woman for it. Anything less to me seems like I am perpetuating a perception of disability and robbing them of the right to make the same decisions I would grant a man. Women aren't porcelain dolls, their strength and endurance varies just as much as men and they should have the same right to get in fights as men. That's just how the ball bounces for me.

One thing I absolutely hate about some of the college-educated feminists I've met is what I call the Educated Denial of Reason. I'm going to be blunt so forgive me. It seems like every person who majors in women's study walks out with this inherent belief that aside from the most glaringly obvious biophysical differences (genitals, development) that men and women must be identical. If you attempt to cite scientific studies that suggest there are fundamental differences in thinking or communication or proficiencies, they counter that the test must have been flawed, or run by only men, or by brainwashed women or... The foundation of their illogical stance seems to be 'If it supports my belief, it should be implicitly accepted. If it runs counter to my theory, the data must be tainted.' Nevermind that this goes against every principle of deductive reasoning used in modern science... This infuriates me not because of the stance itself (though that's ridiculous), but rather that so many of the women I hear it from most are -college educated-. How did people with this greatly of flawed logic manage to pass under the radar? Manage to earn Bachelors and Masters and heaven forbid, Doctorates... and end up teaching impressionable people looking for a scapegoat this same flawed rhetoric that so sadly rings similarly to the arguments used by the Third Reich's science division?

 

[CameraLady]

to everybody saying that women are naturally physically weaker than men:

look at the gendered construction of eating and nutrition. during the most formative years of our lives little boys are expected to be more active and roughhousey than women and thus their parents often supply them with larger portions and specifically bigger cuts of meat than little girls. this continues into adulthood where large raw steaks are considered manly and girls are conditioned to prefer lighter foods and smaller sizes. women spend their lives malnourished due to men getting larger portions of food, and this happens across nearly all ages, races and cultures. the few cultures where women did the physical work and thus demanded the lion's share of the food recorded women being tall and strong while their men were rather stunted in their growth.

you give me a girl that from infancy is given the exact same diet and level of physical exercise as a boy and i will give you an adult woman that is the same size and strength as an adult man.

 

[O-mie]

I absolutely hate feminists. There is a huge difference between a woman who wants to be respected, and a woman who wants "equality". They morph equality into superiority, and it's sickening.

There are women out there who will tell me I'm a disgrace to womankind (I believe they spell it womyn or something, to not be associated with men, LOL.) because I would be willing to be housewifey for my fiance. I sure as hell am not planning on devoting my entire existence to his every need, but what exactly is the crime if I want to take care of the person I love instead of trying to prove I'm better than him or other men? I know I can still make my own money, get my own things.

The fact is, there are some things that men can do better than women, and some things women can do better than men. Women are in no way weak creatures. If they choose to bring themselves up as delicate, however, then that's what they'll be. I choose to bring myself up as capable.

It's just sad that in striving for "equality" they manipulate it into something where they demand to be treated with reverence. Sorry to say, but having a pair of tits isn't gonna automatically earn you that. =A=

 

[Perihelion]

I haven't actually read most of this thread, but I felt the need to chip in anyway.

I absolutely hate feminists. There is a huge difference between a woman who wants to be respected, and a woman who wants "equality". They morph equality into superiority, and it's sickening.

No, you hate militant feminists. There's a difference.

Wanting equality is incredibly different from wanting superiority. I consider myself a feminist, and I believe men and women should have equal opportunities and choices, and while women are harmed by gender stereotypes, so are men. To fix one group's problems requires fixing the other's problems as well, not replacing one broken paradigm with another. It's not about putting women on a pedestal or giving them special privileges. I neither expect nor want special treatment, and I think anyone who does is just continuing the idea that women are frail and need to be protected--and needless to say, it's not fair to men either. I would consider a lot of you who say you hate feminism to be feminists as well based on the ideas you've expressed here. You're just not extremists.

It irks me when a perfectly legitimate philosophy gets trashed because of a few outspoken crazies. It's like saying all of civil rights was about black supremacy, or hating all of Islam because of Al-Qaeda.

 

[O-mie]

I want equality, but I wouldn't call myself feminist at all. I call that common sense. The meaning of the word feminism has seemed to change pretty drastically over the years. And honestly, it's not just a few crazies, it's quite a lot. I'm not saying all are - but though you would push a title at me, I refuse it. I don't need, nor do I want any title telling me that I have to "be" something just because I feel a certain way.

Like I said, to me, that kind of stuff is common sense. I'm not into bananaism if I like and encourage the nutrition of a banana in the world of fruits and vegetables. Same here. I'm a titleless person who believes in what she happens to believe in. It's as simple as that.

 

[Alypt]

@Perihelion: Exactly. People misunderstand it because of the root "feminine" is in the term, but it's basically targeted towards all gender equality, including male gender equality.

A few women use the term feminism as an excuss to be mean and superior towards men.
So-called feminists who do that are not feminists, they're sexists. They're giving feminism a bad name.

Every time I see that "militant feminist" I just want to smack them in the face. Gah.

 

[Sauk]

It just seems as though feminism is just a hobby anymore for bitter fat women who hate men to partake in "for the good of their gender". Whenever I see a "feminist" anymore, it's normally either a teenager who doesn't know what the fuk feminism is even about / thinks it's about getting special treatment, a fat bitter woman who hates men, or some college student who's taken a woman's study class.

One thing I hate the most is the oppression argument.
" Women weren't allowed to go to school, they had to stay home and take care of children, cook, clean, etc. They also didn't have the right to vote."

Men as young as 16 were drafted into wars to die on foreign soil, had to bear the burden of financing their family, had to work in jobs with such poor working conditions that they could die at the job site, and at a time weren't allowed to vote either.

One thing I hear all the time is the topic of "Women get paid less than a man does." which I'm pretty sure is illegal. As well as being illegal, corporations must be stupid as hell in that light, since if women are being paid less than men, shouldn't there be more women in the workforce than men? I thought the point of making money was spending as little as possible.

 

[Venetia]

oh dear:

to everybody saying that women are naturally physically weaker than men:

look at the gendered construction of eating and nutrition. during the most formative years of our lives little boys are expected to be more active and roughhousey than women and thus their parents often supply them with larger portions and specifically bigger cuts of meat than little girls. this continues into adulthood where large raw steaks are considered manly and girls are conditioned to prefer lighter foods and smaller sizes. women spend their lives malnourished due to men getting larger portions of food, and this happens across nearly all ages, races and cultures. the few cultures where women did the physical work and thus demanded the lion's share of the food recorded women being tall and strong while their men were rather stunted in their growth.

you give me a girl that from infancy is given the exact same diet and level of physical exercise as a boy and i will give you an adult woman that is the same size and strength as an adult man.

ok ok

ok okokok ok

ok

no

what

lol

no


ok hold on


In your defense, yes, boys are raised differently. Sometimes they participate in different activities. Usually, girls are discouraged from sports and things early in life. This is not always the case. In most first-world modern countries, divisions between genders in childhood years (0-10) lie mostly in toys, fashion, and role models. Super extremely seldom in food, exercise, health, or wealth distribution.

BUUUUT

sounds like you need a little gigantic lesson in hormones!

Gender differences in metabolism: practical and nutritional implications

Incredibly simplified summary:

Hormones are chemicals internally secreted within a person's body (or many other organisms ... but will not get into that). They are produced in the endocrine system.

Sex hormones, also known as gonadal steroids, are produced mainly in the reproductive system. The hormones produced by the gonads (in males) are different from those produced by the ovaries (in females).

The main hormones that affect gender differences are:

- Testosterone (mostly produced by gonads (males))
- Estrogen (mostly produced by ovaries (females))
- Progesterone (mostly produced from menstruation (females))

Males will make a relatively small amount of estrogen at any given time, and females will make a relatively small amount of testosterone at any given time. But not a huge amount.

This is specified in a person's chromosomes. (Women have XX sex chromosomes, and males have XY.)

Sometimes there are differences or errors on a genetic level, but the majority of people follow this biological template.


Very simply, this is what these hormones do:

TESTOSTERONE:
- Babies/children: Grows male genitals/reproductive centers.
- Instigates and/or inhibits hair manufacture, physical growth, body odor.
- Facilitates chemicals responsible for muscle/tissue breakdown and repair (causes denser muscle/bone structure).
- Neurologically associates: anger, dominance, energy, libido
- Increases energy output from tissue & brain
- Speeds up metabolism & fat burn.
- Increases blood pressure.

ESTROGEN:
- Babies/children: Grows female genitals/reproductive centers & breasts.
- Instigates and regulates the endometrium (uterine lining - menstruation), vaginal lubrication, and pheomelanin (redness in skin/blushing).
- Facilitates chemicals responsible for fat storage and water retention (causes weaker muscle/bone structure).
- Neurologically associates: sadness, obsession, awareness
- Decreases calcium amounts in blood derived from bone resorption
- Slows down metabolism & fat burn.
- (May) decrease blood pressure & improve lung function.


Progesterone is created during the menstrual and gestation (pregnancy) cycles. For the purpose of this discussion, it mostly just causes further fat/water retention.



Super Short tl;dr Summary:

Men produce a lot of testosterone. It activates during puberty. Testosterone increases strength & endurance. It strengthens muscle tissue. It makes them taller.

Women produce a lot of estrogen. It activates during puberty. Estrogen increases fat deposits & water retention. It weakens muscle tissue. It slows height growth.


AND SO:

No, if you had a typical boy and a typical girl of a similar ethnic background, of similar size at birth, both raised identically their whole lives, and never given artificial or medical steroids, at adulthood, they would NOT have the same physical strength.

Not even a little close.

(and the male would likely be taller. (perhaps a lot taller.))

Sorry

 

[moog]

to everybody saying that women are naturally physically weaker than men:

look at the gendered construction of eating and nutrition. during the most formative years of our lives little boys are expected to be more active and roughhousey than women and thus their parents often supply them with larger portions and specifically bigger cuts of meat than little girls. this continues into adulthood where large raw steaks are considered manly and girls are conditioned to prefer lighter foods and smaller sizes. women spend their lives malnourished due to men getting larger portions of food, and this happens across nearly all ages, races and cultures. the few cultures where women did the physical work and thus demanded the lion's share of the food recorded women being tall and strong while their men were rather stunted in their growth.

you give me a girl that from infancy is given the exact same diet and level of physical exercise as a boy and i will give you an adult woman that is the same size and strength as an adult man.

lol did you register just to post this?