Taking the right in own hands .

[Aepriz]

What I mean is suicide .
Someone of my school killed herself on the age of 13 .

I can't get how someone can do something like that to herself.
And to her friends ..
And especialy ... Her parents .

How big the problemes are there is always a better ay then that .
Like when some guys are picking on you , just smack him .
When your low on money find an extra job and stuf like that .

I see life as a gift , And I can't get (stand) people who think there god and end there own life .

What do you think of this ,
Most people think different .. and say I'm feeling less saying that .

If you think that to please explain me why , most people can't .
If you think like me , explain to why you think that .
I don't mean mine bad , I just don't understand how someone can do something like that .

 

[Hevendor]

Well, ultimately, life is a gift given to you. You have every right to end it.

When something in your life goes so wrong that you need to quit, you don't really think about anything else. It takes a certain degree of immersion in problems to make you forget about everyone/everything in your life that you care/cares about you.

If a 13-year old killed herself, she either had mental issues or problems beyond what you can even imagine. Or a little bit of both. The god argument doesn't hold much water - what would you say about an atheist that takes his own life?

 

[Ratty524]

Depression, put downs, and all of such pains are simply a part of one's life. The only real way to solve such problems is to endure them or "deal with it", unfortunately some people can't, or believe they can't handle that and commit suicide.

As much as I believe that life isn't the best thing in the world, what's the point in ending it early? Why not live your life just for the purpose of gaining experience and knowledge about it?

 

[Beadly_Dastard]

"All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated...As therefore the bell that rings to a sermon, calls not upon the preacher only, but upon the congregation to come: so this bell calls us all: but how much more me, who am brought so near the door by this sickness....No man is an island, entire of itself...any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind; and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee."

-John Donne

I feel really strongly about suicide; in my mind, it is a decision so stupid that it will always be stupid, no matter the context in which it is done.
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@Hevendor: If the one contemplating suicide is an atheist, then all the more reason not to.  That is, assuming that the atheist has no belief in the afterlife.

 

[Luminier]

I feel really strongly about suicide; in my mind, it is a decision so stupid that it will always be stupid, no matter the context in which it is done.

What if you were an eighty-seven year-old man, who can't do anything yourself. Can't get up to use the bathroom, can't feed yourself, can't even speak coherently. The memories which you can recall are ones of abuse, physical, psychological, and sexual. Everyday is a living hell. Would you really want to live through that? I know I wouldn't. Of course, that old man wouldn't be able to kill himself, anyway. :x

@Hevendor: If the one contemplating suicide is an atheist, then all the more reason not to.  That is, assuming that the atheist has no belief in the afterlife.

Oh, how I would hate it, if there were an afterlife. I'm no atheist, but I don't believe in an afterlife. When my life ends, I want it to end. That's it. No more. I'd be way too weary, anyway. Reincarnation would be nice, though.

I can't really understand ending your life at such a young age as thirteen, though. There's so much ahead of you.

 

[mawk]

And I can't get (stand) people who think there god and end there own life .

Suicide is the ultimate act of escapism; I don't think it really matters what one's escaping to. I even think a lot of people would prefer total oblivion, considering their hypothetical mindset.

Besides, in a lot of religions, suicide gets you a ticket straight to Blazes. A very devout religious person would likely need more motivation than an atheist, since it's Hell waiting for them instead of, well, nothing.

I think in the majority of cases, suicide's the last resort of a coward. It's the large-scale equivalent of upturning a chess board because you don't like the way the game's going. Not only that, it's selfish. Suicide is relatively easy past the first stroke, but for others it has incredible long-term consequences. My uncle committed suicide a few years ago, and it devastated my aunt beyond what I can express in typing. Recently, her dog (formerly their dog, one reminder of him) died, and she had to experience that all over again. I doubt people who commit suicide think things through like this. Among those who do, I'm sure there's more than a handful of people who hope their suicide genuinely hurts those close to them.

I don't give a shit how awful Angsty Teen X's life was; with the current fetish our society has with dramatizing everything, what they went through is likely nothing compared to what it does to those who care about them. In theory, you have a right to end your own life if you're a hermit with no living relatives. But let's say you have a family, a wife, etc.; you have no right to toss their lives aside.

Of course, there are situations where suicide would be justified or honourable; however, I doubt those circumstances apply to most people who indulge themselves as such nowadays.

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

God how many suicide topics are we going to cover.
It's enough to make me want to drown myself in them.

Everyone looks at suicide as escapism, which it can easily be.  Escapism is a bit to broad and/or vague depending on which point we're making.  Some people honestly believe their loved one's lives would be better off with out them, others do it as an absolute form of apology.  I had a friend who was molested by her father, and when her mother found out it was a bit too late.  So, she ended up losing her daughter who ended up living with an aunt, and her husband.
It was her fault.  She should have seen the signs.  She didn't do the act, but she was at fault in her own mind.  She knew she would end up with her daughter again, which was the discussion.  And if she couldn't even protect her with in her own home what kind of mother could she be?  What more damage could she do to this child who is so scared of people now.  She let this happen.  She also let the chair fall out from under her after tying a noose around her neck and writing an apology letter to her daughter.

Escapism?
Yes, it can easily be commented as so.  The same escapism as "everything's my fault, no body loves me - boo hoo, wrist meet mr. scissor blade"?  Not entirely.  Same suicide as the samurai who failed to protect his charge and so slices his belly three times and has someone else chop his head?  It's closer to that if anything else.  That's honorable in some eyes, though I still think barbaric.

The thing is, you can't understand why this mother did it.  What I've stated is mostly a guess.  Perhaps she went mad with the realization, and simply went insane.  You really can't say, unless you've been there.

People look at depression and go "Oh get over it already".  If you've ever had someone close to you die, and had in that day or two someone say "get over it" you'd know how ridiculous saying "get over it" really is.  If you see someone burning, running around screaming while on chemical fire, your not going to say "Oh stop it's just a little sting, get over it" will you?  And if so, go ahead and hang yourself now we don't need you, thanks.

Depression is a major problem for us with complex thoughts.  It destroys us and eats us alive.  People have become depressed and stopped eating, drinking, for no reason whatsoever.  Forget when a stresser happens that causes people to snap.  Ever get that upset you just punch a wall?  Imagine being that angry every day.  Unrelenting.  Ever get that sad you just laid in bed, TV off, and just breathed?  Imagine that every day.

Go on that for 25 years, get blamed in two suicide notes yourself, and have two or three suicide attempts under your belt by the time your 17 and tell me suicide is easy.  Walking away from the noose is the hardest part.  Putting it around your neck is painless.

 

[kaze950]

If people want to kill themselves, let them. They own their bodies. And for the record, at least in Christianity, suicide doesn't make you automatically go to hell.

I have a question though: Is anyone here who is against people having the right to kill themselves pro-choice?

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

I'm pro choice and I'm 100% against killing oneself.
The two, for me, are ultimately different.  One is living, and the other isn't yet.  Just my view on it.  But I still think  that would make a better subject on it's own rather than hijacking this one for.

 

[kaze950]

I'm against people killing themselves, but that doesn't mean I don't believe they shouldn't be able to. If a woman has a right to kill something that isn't her, I think all humans should have the right to kill themselves. It seems fundamental.

 

[Venetia]

I believe that the right to your own life is sacred. You are the sole guarantor of your life, and if it fails, you should be more than allowed to take it. It's the only thing in the world that is TRULY yours.

It's the easy way out, sure. But if you're actually so bad off that the only way out is OUT, then why should anyone stop you unless they can provide some real, meaningful solutions, or reasons as to why you should remain among the breathing?

I tried to off myself many times growing up. I lived in a horrible pit of squalor and depression. But I was always too chicken shit to go through with it. That means that I had just barely enough hope left to pull myself away from death. The people who succeed at suicide obviously had NOTHING that would pull them back from that brink of destruction.

People don't just say, "oh, boo hoo, I didn't get into college, so I'm gonna drive my car off the overpass." No, it's a build-up of many traumas over a long period of time, ending in a point where they're aiming their car at the edge and they have a moment to think about it. It's not a split-second decision. It takes guts and determination.

If they're so unhappy about their lives that they cannot bear to go on living, then who cares? Just means more resources for everyone else who DO care about their lives. Sure, it hurts everyone who loved that person, but the ultimate act of selfishness, of suicide, should be an indicator that they never cared enough about YOU to hang on for you.

 

[e]

I don't have much to add, but I did see someone mention depression at some point.

For the record, victims of major depressions rarely ever choose to commit suicide; there is simply nothing else they can do. It's a cognitive pattern in which they cannot see any way out, except that one. It is a form of escape, true, but anyone suffering from major depression without the required emotional support would end up committing suicide, even if you believe you are the world's strongest. It's defeatism at its best.

 

[Venetia]

Not true. Depression is a chemical imbalance brought on my negative influences (or, once in a great while, nothing at all), but it's not a kiss of death. Just because you're mortally depressed doesn't mean you're going to take the plunge. It just means you wish for death, you wish for it all to be over. Just for some people, they're determined enough to go that extra step.

When I was in the deepest pits of depression, nobody helped me though it and I took no medication. The only reason I didn't pull the trigger was because I worried that no one'd take care of my cat.

THAT'S ALL.

Sometimes it's just that one little glimpse--that strand of thread--which holds you back before hitting that point of no return. Suicide is totally a choice. If you don't think so, then you've never really, truly been to that point. It's not like the chemicals in your brain are forcing you to pick up that gun.

 

[e]

I did not once say depressions necessarily ends in suicide. I meant to say that depressed people who do commit suicide didn't simply go and say "Oh, I think today I'll commit suicide!". They didn't consciously choose to do such an act. That's all.

 

[Ellie]

I bet you never let that cat out of your sight now

The thing people don't realise when talking about topics like these is that the only people who know what these people are going through are themselves. A bully might not realise calling someone names hurts them and makes them not want to go to school each day, because that bully has never been in that situation to know what it feels like. It's useless trying to understand where these people come from, because unless you have attempted to commit suicide before, you wouldn't know. It must take great courage, but also a really incredibly bad state of mind, to be able to willingly take your own life.

 

[Venetia]

I bet you never let that cat out of your sight now

Nope! He's still here with me, fat and old and spoiled ;').

The thing people don't realise when talking about topics like these is that the only people who know what these people are going through are themselves. A bully might not realise calling someone names hurts them and makes them not want to go to school each day, because that bully has never been in that situation to know what it feels like. It's useless trying to understand where these people come from, because unless you have attempted to commit suicide before, you wouldn't know. It must take great courage, but also a really incredibly bad state of mind, to be able to willingly take your own life.

It just sucks. I also knew a dude in school who off'ed himself (a gruesome way, too--steak knife in the heart). I was a pretty obvious case--history of abuse, extreme poverty, the whole bit--so it's like people sympathized with my attitude. But the kid that actually killed himself lived in a nice neighborhood and had (seemingly) loving parents. No one really knew why he did it, since he never left a note, so all you can do is wonder about the true roots of his anguish.

Whatever it was, it was bad enough for him to decide that death was the only option, and perhaps it was a poor decision, but it was his to make.

 

[Beadly_Dastard]

What, nobody liked my Donne quote? :down: Anyways, my thoughts on suicide basically stem from my belief in inherent human worth. The chances of your birth are so infintessimally small as to be nonexistent:

Consider the 7 hundred million sperm that your father produces (or at least used to produce) per day.  Couple this with the 400 different eggs that your mother has produced in her lifetime.  Then, consider the chances (about one in 6 billion) that your parents would meet. (I would get into the rest of the probabilities, but I think that I've gone far enough :tongue

Considering the literal miracle of your birth, I believe that you owe it to those who may have been born in your place to live a full life.  To do anything other than that is a nearly incomprehendable waste.

Basically, it's like winning the lottery ten times in a row(tax-free), only to burn the winning tickets in front of starving hobos.

 

[Seijin]

My belief on Suicide is that ultimately whether you disagree or agree on it, it is upto the person thinking about it. I know I am just repeating what others have posted above me but still I mean, I have gone through depression as well and I am still technically at a young age, only reason I am still here talking to you guys on this forum is because I was smart enough to think about how it would affect my mother and sister that and I have too much pride to just kill myself. Most people that have thought about suicide have gone through situations which to them is too much for them to easily handle like others. For an example the kid who grew up in a nice neighborhood he probably had something going on in his life no one else knew about that got to him. Or if you want to go into genetics he may have grown up in a happy environment but got handed a bad gene which caused a brain imbalance.

All I know is that when you get down to it, it stems solely on the person's will power and ability to cope with their problems and surroundings. As for the 13 year old girl that killed herself I mean either she was abused, had a horrible young childhood, was too irrational, or just could not cope with drama at school. In the end I stand by my belief that it is the decision of the person no matter what. In the end whether you try and help them or not, give them meds, or send them to a psychologist, ultimately it is within that person's own hands and their will power and knowledge.

Again I am sorry if I am just repeating what others have stated before me. I just felt the need to speak my mind no matter how redundant or plain it might seem.

 

[Dissonance]

Nobody has the right to tell a person they can't kill themselves.  If they want to do it, they should.  If circumstances ended up with somebody trusting in me enough to ask me to help them out, I would probably do it.  I do believe there's such a thing as a mercy killing.

As for actual suicides by yourself, though, if you're going to go out you need to do it in an awesome fashion.  My personal favourite is gluing your hands to your head, then rigging up a line so that when you jump off a building, an extremely sharp, thin cord slices your head off.  Your body then dangles held up by other, thicker ropes just a meter above the pavement, so you hang there, holding your head in your hands.  :thumb: