Save the Dolphins?

[Lene]

I remember being sent this movie a long time ago, and recently I was reminded of it because Hayden Pantierre (Heroes' Claire Bennet) got into some clash between Japanese fishermen over the fishing of dolphins.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=LjqZi46P8Gs

When I had first watched the movie, I was horrified! was sad. It seemed like a horrible thing to kill dolphins! I mean, why would someone kill poor little Flipper?

Then I thought about it, let the inital shock wear off and as a omnivore and a person who eats meat, I feel I would be a hypocrite if I was outraged at the "slaughter" of dolphins, yet continue to eat meat, chicken other fish.

I mean, dolphins are intelligent mammals, smarter than most animals out there. They seem to have social interactions that mirror humanity. But, taking a leaf from The Lion King, it's all about the Circle of Life. They're lower on the food chain than humans. If someone wants to eat dolphin, and they're able to go hunt and kill one to do so, then why is this unethical?

If there is a demand for dolphin in Japan, why are people so shocked that there are fisherman who are willing to supply that demand?

I'm pretty sure Bambi and Little Bunny Foo Foo had fawns and little bunnies to take care of as well. There's a good chance their young will die of starvation or will be killed by other predators because I killed their parents for venison or rabbit meat. That's life though!

 

[rexxzecutioner]

Humans have intervened with the natural selection process and extinction of many, many organisms. Undoubtedly our industrialization has caused much of this aswell, but it is the nature of the beast.

I am all for conservation efforts, but there comes a point to draw the line and accept that we are not meant to be the savior of every species of life on this planet, we have far more important things to focus on.

 

[PINEDAXP]

I agree, it's awful, but exactly the same thing happens everywhere. I'll tell you an example.

El Coco Island, known to be one of the world's most biodiversity rich places, a protected area, Human Patrimony declared by the UNESCO. Everyday, turtles, sharks, fish, and so on is killed with no purpose and extremely savage.

Human proves itself over and over to be the one animal that kills for fun and other than alimentation.

There's no stopping this, and I agree. That's cruel, but yeah, there's no much we can do about it. But it is as important, or far more, as many of the crap we humans worry about.

 

[Roman Candle]

Would you eat gorilla? Would you get upset if apes were hunted for food?

 

[PINEDAXP]

For food? No, I wouldn't mind. But dolphins and sharks aren't hunted for food, mostly.... Sharks' main reason to be hunted is their cartilages

 

[Roman Candle]

Oh...
Well I would mind!

 

[Lene]

Everyday, turtles, sharks, fish, and so on is killed with no purpose and extremely savage.

Yeah but in the case of the dolphins, they are being fished for food. Which, imo, is a valid purpose.

Would you eat gorilla? Would you get upset if apes were hunted for food?

All I gotta say to this is: Do you know what is in your hotdogs these days?

It depends. Some apes are endangered species, so that changes things slightly for me.

 

[Despain]

As far as I know, dolphins aren't an endangered species. They're also pretty large, so I'd assume that one dolphin could produce a lot of food. Regardless of their intelligence, which does make this a little more disturbing than cattle, I can't bring myself to really speak against it.

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

All this is, is a newer version of the animated gif of a pig being chainsaw decapitated. Only not as funny to throw at vegans when they get all preachy about your eating habits.

If we are allowed to eat cattle/pigs we can eat dolphin. We can eat silver back gorilla if we want, we just have to wait for the endangered species list to check it off when they're populated enough.

There is no difference between a dolphin and a pig in some studies apparently. Both have high intelligence in comparison to other mammals, and high social abilities. Supposable as they say.

 

[Jeff the Green]

A) Dolphins are predators, not evolved to have a sustainable population if they're hunted, so human hunting will rapidly lead to a population crash

B) Saying that deciding we shouldn't hunt a species to extinction is "being their savior" is like saying that terrorists are the saviors to the prisoners they don't behead.

C) Ever heard of the butterfly effect? A butterfly flaps its wings in Japan, and a hurricane starts of the coast of Brazil. Dolphin populations drop, the population of their prey (medium-level predator fish) balloons, causing a massive drop in in the population of the medium-level predators' prey, which we eat. Most ecosystems can absorb a new low-level predator (humans who eat non-predatory animals). None can absorb a predator above its top predator without causing chaos and often extinction.

 

[Fafnir]

I'm going to take a line from the book of Maddox, and say this: What have dolphins ever done for you?

 

[rpgfan_2007]

This thread is retarded.

Anyone who is outraged by killing of animal _____ (fill in the blank) should ask themselves where that piece of chicken or steak comes from. hint: not from a tree.

It's extremely hypocritical for one group who eats meat to yell and complain at another group for eating xyz. What's the difference?

That said, there is nothing wrong with eating meat. I have the most intelligent, adorable little puppy who is more precious to me than most people. Would I ever eat a dog? Absolutely not. But I eat chicken, and cows, fish everyday. But would I be outraged if another people ate a dog? Yes. But then logically, I shouldn't. Becaues it doesn't make sense to.

Fact is, if you love animals, and ARE a meat eater, you're a hypocrite. So hypocrites shouldn't be pointing fingers.

If an entire nation (xyz) was 100% vegetarian, then fine, they have a right to complain against any animal killing nation. But a nation or people that does eat meat or kills animals for xyz reasons, shouldn't be pointing the finger at another nation. It's hypocritical to do so.

We humans are a very stupid species. I have no doubt that my dog is superior to all of us.

 

[Jeff the Green]

@rpgfan_2007
You'd be right if we were talking about horses, lambs, calves, dogs, cats or another domestic animal that we breed and aren't part of any food chain. We're talking about a wild animal, part of a long and complex food chain, and one which cannot, as I pointed out, that cannot survive having a predator.

 

[$t3v0]

Shit happens. I'd rather governments concentrate on saving human lives before dolphins.

 

[rpgfan_2007]

@rpgfan_2007
You'd be right if we were talking about horses, lambs, calves, dogs, cats or another domestic animal that we breed and aren't part of any food chain. We're talking about a wild animal, part of a long and complex food chain, and one which cannot, as I pointed out, that cannot survive having a predator.

It doesn't matter if it's domestic or in the wild. You're trying to distort the main issue which is the morality of killing animals for consumption, and turn it into a domestic vs wild argument. But it doesn't make a difference if it's wild or domestic. We still kill animals for consumption. They kill animals for consumption. Who are we to point fingers?

I'm not saying that it's immoral to eat meat. That is debateable. I'm saying, it's hypocrisy to eat meat and point fingers at another nation for doing the same, which is what you're attempting to do, but you try to camouflage it by making this into a domestic vs wild.

Now, I am not defending Japan. I think Japan has a lot of issues, and it really is a lost country. But I get sick of hypocrisy. I get sick of dumb politicans calling others "evil doers". It's just a sick sick world we live in right now.

So maybe I'm a tad touchy when I see vile hypocrisy and scumbag liars.

 

[$t3v0]

rpgfan wins! (I'd also like to take the time to issue the question WHY people seem to like Japan so much? Barr anime shite. It's a shithole)

 

[Jeff the Green]

You don't get it. If the Japanese were farming dolphins it would be much less of a problem (I'd still have moral problems with it, but those are more personal, more speculative, and less relevant to this discussion). Killing a top level predator in such large numbers always destabilizes an ecosystem, and destabilizing ecosystems is always bad for humans. It's the same reason that it's illegal everywhere in the US to hunt birds of prey.

 

[$t3v0]

That's because your national icon is an eagle. Or at least that plays a VERY large part in it. It wouldn't surprise me.

 

[rpgfan_2007]

You don't get it. If the Japanese were farming dolphins it would be much less of a problem (I'd still have moral problems with it, but those are more personal, more speculative, and less relevant to this discussion). Killing a top level predator in such large numbers always destabilizes an ecosystem, and destabilizing ecosystems is always bad for humans. It's the same reason that it's illegal everywhere in the US to hunt birds of prey.

Sorry but you're the one who doesn't get it. I've tried to explain it to you but you seem to think raising animals is humane, and moral and therefore, ok to kill but it's somehow worse to kill wild animals.

I'd argue that at least the dolphin, for it's period of time, was free to live naturally. The chicken that is raised for KFC has probably never known freedom, but raised in a cramped cage, forced to eat and be fattened. You think treating domestic animals this way is humane and moral? and you think it's immoral for Japanese to kill wild dolphins?

If you eat meat, like me, then you and I both should not be pointing fingers. Go do some research on how pleasant these domesticated livestock animals are raised, and how cruel their end is. Is it pleasant for these cows to have their necks sliced opened? or chickens head cut off? I don't care what rationale you use to justify your hypocritical judgement because in the end, killing is killing.

 

[Venetia]

The problem lies in the fact that a chicken is not endangered and taking it from the ecosystem will not upset the balance of the ecosystem around it. Dolphins are very endangered and very important to their ecosystem, and thusly we should be able to refrain from killing them, atleast until they are no longer endangered.

You're missing that we're higher creatures capable of reason and able to amass food, so there's no reason to shit all over the ecosystem more than we already have by completely removing an entire species from it.