Jehova, and naming God

[Ellie]

So I got thinking in the bathroom (as you do) about religion. I can't remember what spurred the thought but I'm sure it's not important.

We aren't allowed to say Jehova. I say we, I'm not a Christian, but generally, a lot of Christians see naming their god as a sin. Nobody is getting stoned - even if they do say "Jehova!"

Nobody nowadays says Jehova, everyone says "God".

God is a pretty loose word, and at current is synonymous with "deity"; Allah is a god, Shiva a god, etc.

My theory on the matter is based on what's actually happened in the Christian world.

[we] were banned from saying "the lord's name" because then we would have to use the ambiguous "God". By never mentioning that god is Jehova, instead, the Christian world came to know Jehova as God, and the word God became even more ambiguous. There was now a concept of "A God" versus "The God".

Not only did this make Jehova THE GOD, which is pretty big in a religious following sense (it essentially shuns out other gods as being just "gods", not "THE GOD", but it goes further:

"In God We Trust" is printed on American bank notes. Regardless of the intentions, it could be interpreted in two ways:

"We trust that there is a god watching over us"
"We trust that Jehova is watching over us"

The first is religiously secular, in a rather nice way to be honest. It isn't atheist, it's religious but in an umbrella sence. We trust that there is a god.

The second, because "God" is now ambiguous to a large degree, implies that we trust in a god that that god is God (Jehova). In Jehova we trust.

Now, it comes to thought that if Jehova had been just known as Jehova and not as "God", it would be a lot easier to be non-conformist, religious wise.

In the ex-Christian world, if somebody asks if you are religious, they almost always mean "are you Christian". If you say you are atheist, they ask why you aren't religious, but by religious what they mean is Christian. Indeed, books like The God Delusion and similar are often seen as anti-Christian not anti-Godconcept.

Would the world have been different if we hadn't named Jehova "God" and had let people use it instead? (Or forced people to use it instead?)

Well, a lot of phrases would become a lot less ambiguous for one.

"Oh my God" would be in reference to my god (your god, w/e) and not "Oh JEHOVA" which is a lot more specific. "Oh my God" isn't blasphemy when you consider what God means (it isn't just proxy for Jehova but could be any god). Parodied in the simpsons with "Oh my various Gods".

Of course, in that case, would Jehova just eventually evolve to be the ambiguous "god"?

In short, and as a tl;dr:

By teaching people to use the word God instead of Jehova they have enforced the idea that "religious" means "christian", that any mention of god pertains to Jehova, that they have THE God and that their religion is the one true one with all others being nonconformist.

(If this spawns a conversation so be it but I just wanted to get my toilet-thoughts off my mind with a bit of a religious rant).

 

[dadevvtsvre]

I don't know if this helps, but my mom is a Jehovah's Witness, and they almost always refer to God as Jehovah. They take pride in calling God by name, and think it's strange and silly that most Christian sects call him only "Lord" or "God".

 

[Twirly]

What about people who type g-d

 

[Ellie]

They're just silly and completely misunderstanding the concept of "not saying gods name". :|

 

[moog]

I don't know if this helps, but my mom is a Jehovah's Witness, and they almost always refer to God as Jehovah. They take pride in calling God by name, and think it's strange and silly that most Christian sects call him only "Lord" or "God".

This. My grandmother raised my mom and her family as jehovahs witnesses, so I was raised under god being called jehovah, so I still refer to him as that every once in awhile.

 

[So fist]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNeq2Utm0nU

 

[Venetia]

i always figured that the commonality of describing the christian jehovah as "god" was a posturing thing.

indirectly stating, "this is the god to end all gods; nah nah nah nah boo boo stick your holy books in doodoo"

of course im pretty cynical about these things.

 

[So fist]

It's actually a debate as to whether it's a mistranslation between ancient hebrew -> latin -> english. It centers around how you are intended to vocalize the ancient hebrew letters that form the word and whether that word as it's vocalized is meant to be mispronounced from what the conventional spelling would tell you. The point of not invoking god's name is that his name is sacred and not meant to be invoked for our petty vanities.

 

[So fist]

rather god's name is not sacred it's that god is sacred.

 

[So fist]

Anyway jews have a whole host of names for god to say in different situations to avoid saying god's revered actual name. In liturgical settings the rabbi will commonly use Adonai which roughly translates to our lord. In casual settings an orthodox would allow himself to indulge in saying hashem, translates to roughly The name.

 

[Mr_Smith]

I don't really get the point of this post, but maybe that is because I don't know what Jehova's Witnesses actually are, and what they believe in. Other then that, I don't believe in any god, so I'm just as cynical about these topics as, I think, most other HBGames members.

 

[Ellie]

I don't really get the point of this post, but maybe that is because I don't know what Jehova's Witnesses actually are, and what they believe in. Other then that, I don't believe in any god, so I'm just as cynical about these topics as, I think, most other HBGames members.

Jehova's Witnesses are a branch of Christianity

Christianity believe in one God, Jehova

 

[Mr_Smith]

So they are like the most hardcore Christians alive?

 

[megalukes]

Church said people is not allowed to use god's name because it's sacred or whatever, but it's interesting to say that the Bible itself (book which church seems do have faith) says people MUST use it, because god is just a term to define if something is superior or not. I can say I'm god of the RPG Maker (ok, just kidding hahaha), just as example rs

I'm Jehova's witness, and despite of all the concepts of this belief, our main goal is to rescue all Christianity's believes who's been lost since Church assumed control about what is right or wrong. God's real name was the first one long ago.

 

[Mr_Smith]

Well, books like the Bible often say things people don't follow.
The Koran, for example, says 'You shall not kill'.
Yea I know... The Bible says the same.

 

[Draycos Goldaryn]

By teaching people to use the word God instead of Jehova they have enforced the idea ... that they have THE God and that their religion is the one true one with all others being nonconformist.

I do believe you have hit the nail on the head. As I was raised as a christian (various denominations) This was the thing drilled into my head, that God (Jehovah) is the only true god and belief in Jesus dying for our sins is the only way to get into heaven. Anyone who says differently has been fooled by Satan.

About 10th Grade (1998) I began questioning this. I read a book, Mists of Avalon, the way this book viewed religion and the way Christianity overtook the old Celtic beliefs, and Morgaine's realization at the end opened my mind to other possibilities than the one drilled into me since birth. Shortly after, in World history, we covered the various major world religions and I noticed similarities between all of them. It wasn't long after that when I began to consider myself "Used-to-be-Christian" and Agnostic.

After years of various studying and contemplation, I have finally shed my Agnostic beliefs and can say I do believe in a "Higher Power" but do not believe him/her/it/them to be the creator and supreme deity. I always use a Star Wars quote to explain why I do believe:

There is always a bigger fish.

I also do not believe in an Absolute Truth, but instead that truth is relative (the biggest source of this belief is the many interpretations of the
bible that have spawned so many different denominations of Christianity yet they all consider themselves Christian, and some consider themselves the Only True Christians.). Perception is reality. What may be true for one, may not be true for another. There is great power in faith, and if you believe in something strong enough, for you at least, it will be true.

I view the term "being Religious" to mean serving and worshiping whatever deity you choose and placing his/hers/it's/their decree and will before yours. Therefore I am not religious even though I do believe in a higher power. I am not Agnostic as that implies neither the belief nor disbelief in God. I still refer to myself sometimes as "Used-to-be-Christian" as many of my beliefs and practices do stem from that religion, as that is what I was raised under. I have looked into Unitarian Universalism as their teachings seemed to be more inline with my own, but, ultimately, my beliefs differ from them as well. I consider my "religion" ( and I use that term loosely here) to be Freedom of Religion. Anyone can believe and practice as they choose so long as they do not try to enforce their beliefs on me and I will not force mine onto them in turn.

I do have more to say on this subject, but to avoid a huge wall of text, I may elaborate further in another post later.

-- Draycos Goldaryn

 

[Venetia]

off topic, but it needs to be said:

-- Draycos Goldaryn

You don't need to sign off on your post, we know who wrote it: your membername is exactly to the left of your post, and if we quote you, your name comes up in the field automatically.

 

[moog]

but ven he is the CEO of goldagerewin entertainment he must sign his prestegious name

 

[EnderX]

1) If I am understanding you correctly, then I believe your main point only holds valid in those segments of the world covered by the original Roman Empire - it's a result of the Roman Emperors trying to hijack the Christian faith for political purposes. In other areas of the world, the issue wouldn't hold in the same way.

2) 'Jehovah' isn't the name of the god of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. The Hebrew rendering would be Yod, He, Vau, He* - commonly transliterated into English as 'YHVH' - a term sometimes called the Tetragrammaton. (A term which itself is sometimes used as an indirect reference to the Lord God of Israel.) Hebrew didn't have specific letters for vowels the way English does - it used a set of secondary marks to define what vowels would appear, and where.** The controversy in the Name is that no one's quite sure what the appropriate vowel points are for 'YHVH'. (Hence the alternate variations such as 'Yahweh'.) From what I've read, the word 'Jehovah' itself comes from an attempt to stick the vowel pointing for Adonai, a word which, as mentioned above, means 'Lord', into the Tetragrammaton.

3) Your argument itself is based on an at least partially inaccurate premise - I can guarantee you that if you were to ask the Christians I have met what the name of God is, they wouldn't get anywhere near this topic. Instead, they would simply answer 'Jesus Christ'. (And it wouldn't be an expletive.)



*Or He, Vau, He, Yod if actually being read in Hebrew

**I believe this is, at least in part, also the reason for many of those who write the word 'God' as 'G-d'; those I have run into online who do so have invariably been either Israeli (culturally Hebrew) or Jewish (religiously Hebrew).