Being a good mother or father

[BlueScope]

Well, the origin of this thread was a line in the IRC chat, lemme quote it...

if i i dont drink or hit im a good father

I think everyone in his right mind agrees with that being a weird point of view. We had the occassional scratching-at-the-top discussion in IRC, but I'm interested a little further in this topic, or better, what folks generally think about it... we all get older and by getting 20 today, I'm a little bit closer to actually get my hands on a wife instead of just a girl, I guess...

People always tell me that I have a good sense for family and stuff (ironically, as I'm not planning to get me one in the near future really...), so yeah, let's shoot my point and see how it hits American ground
I simply think that you're a good father if you pay attention to your offspring, be strict at times, but very rarely really... other than that, you should show them that they can actually reach you with whatever they did, for example telling them that they did a good job on something - it's the little things that make the whole, really. I also think that you should teach them stuff by yourself, in addition to what school does. Most kids can read and write before they come into kindergarten over here nowadays, because they use computers, but back in my time, I actually was the only one capable of doing that in the early life phases... and well, it was kinda helpful really. This also applies for the whole sexual stuff, which most parents just ignore and let the kids figure it out. If there's some values you can pass on, you might do that as well, but I'm very sceptic about passing on religious believes, because everyone should be able to make him- or herself an image of the whole religious world and decide for him- or herself accordingly. Also, I'm against the "I know it's good, so I enforce it"-rule when it comes to the upbringing of a child, but there's the one exception: I'd so put my children in some kind of martial arts school ^_^ And I agree with a couple of buddies on that one, as well...
In general, I think that children learn most stuff by themselves, like responsibility, for example... you gotta show them the basics, though.

Drop in your opinions :p

EDIT: Btw, I don't believe in the traditional roles of mother and father, so year... what I wrote above also applies to the mother part completely... just to add that.

 

[Minkoff]

its possible to molest without drinking or hitting

 

[eternal_magus]

its possible to molest without drinking or hitting

Yeah but it's pretty hard..PM me we'll talk details

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

No it's not very hard at all.
Most sexual predators of young children do not want to physically harm them - they want to love them, in their minds and will prefer not to strike or use what they would see as force. As for alcoholic molesters, these are extremely rare when you get the cases of "love", where the molester truly feels his/her target is in love and fully giving themselves to them. Though the people I'm talking about are more likely to be a stranger, neighbor, or step parent than an actual parent I didn't see anyone say biological parents only.

EDIT:
A good parent is going to be whoever does their best to keep their kids out of harms way, without clipping their wings and stunting their social growth. Provide for them without expectation other than the hopes of them doing well in their life. Protect and nurture them without locking out alternate thoughts and philosophies. Forgiveness, patience, and understanding.

 

[BlueScope]

@60.25: I kinda disagree on the "keep kids out of harms way" point of yours... there's a phrase reading something around "A lion throws his own child in the deepest hole." Well, I definately think you should rather let them solve conflicts by themselves up to a certain point (gotta be careful with your 2nd ammendment there, I guess) and only guide or protect them if they really can't get something done by theirselves. Being overprotective, or even just regularily protective, is not the way to go, IMO... that heavily depends on the situation, though, I guess...

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

My point must not have been clear.
The intent was to do your best to protect them while letting them make their mistakes. Don't step in on every conflict that comes their way, rather teach them to one day be able to solve their problems. To give a good foundation for them to make up their own decisions in life.

If your kid doesn't know what to do when something everyone has experienced comes their way and you shelter them - your kid will be screwed. If your kid is incapable of knowing what to do from inexperience, give guidance but don't solve their problems for them unless they are too young or simply not ready for it. Don't, under any means, let your kids do what they want because you want them to have choice, and don't under any means make every decision for them.
There's a difference between packing a kid's lunch and telling them to wash their hands, and telling the teachers to take the kid out to the bathroom and make them wash their hands before and after lunch - which was a personal hell for a kid in my 4th grade class that he always got funned for.

 

[alexia]

I think there are too many parents these days that are afraid to discipline their children. Instead they offer excuses for their children's behavior and become enablers. Children are children, not adults, yet there are many who try to reason with their children as if they have the thinking capacity of rational adults. The result? Children who have little respect for authority or boundaries and feel a sense of entitlement to all things desirable.

Good parenting involves guidance coupled with discipline. Your children are not your friends, they are your children. As a parent, you will undoubtedly have to make decisions that are unpopular but necessary.

**EDIT**
Here is one of my favorite stories. I interned with a 2nd grade teacher a few years ago and there was an incident in which one of her students stole a tootsie pop that was sitting out on one of her counters. The tootsie pops were going to be used to make "Boo" pops for a fall center. Anyway, when the teacher explained the incident to that child's parent, the mother, enraged, demanded to know why the teacher had left it out in the first place.

The moral? Hide all your personal belongings or they will be stolen!

 

[Diedrupo]

Russell Peters' stand up routine on beating kids pretty much sums up my opinion on the matter:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nn5jlrxcpkI

 

[holloway]

Fuck that, they cheek you give em a good crack. Anti-smacking laws are bloody stupid- when you were younger, did a good harmless smack stop you doing things? Hell yes.

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

Actually they never stopped me. All it did for me was teach me to duck in school yard fights and make it so I can take a good hit easily.

Punishments that made me sit in the corner and miss birthday parties, getting punished and not being allowed to have a birthday party myself - those made me be a good boy... well no, they made me a better liar and counterfeiter.

Though I'd probably still give my kid a quick tap-smack like I do my li'l cousins when they mouth off and act like their my age.

 

[Tohsaka]

Fuck that, they cheek you give em a good crack. Anti-smacking laws are bloody stupid- when you were younger, did a good harmless smack stop you doing things? Hell yes.

Not really. More like encouragement to do it stealthier and less detectable. At least that's how it was for me.

 

[Phoenix647]

Punishment doesn't work. I'm seventeen myself and I just got my laptop taken.

It may make you stop doing something, but for the wrong reasons. Like say i steal a candy bar and get caught, so my mom takes away all my video games. I won't still a candy bar the next time, cause i dont wanna lose my video games again.


So parenting is effective.


Wrong. What happens when I get another chance to still a candy bar, from a sleeping friend, when no one is there to catch me? Well, I wont be caught so i wont lose my games, so theres no loss involved. I steal it.


basically, its just teaching you that if you get caught, bad things happen, so you try harder not to be caught, or else you dont do it for fear or punishment, not because you feel bad for doing so.


wouldnt developing morals be better? I know in some situations, it might be okay to still. Like, what if I had no money, and there was a homeless man starving to death, i wouldnt punish my kid for stealing food for a starving man, risking getting in trouble to help out a poor guy, i would aprove.

i want my kids understanding why, just stealing in general is wrong, and why sometimes doing bad things for good reasons isnt so horrible. (example, police speed and break red light, but their doing it for a greater cause, to catch a drunk driver who is a greater threat)


and I if you punish your kids, by dissaproving of their bad actions, and giving a dissapointed face, this is still bad. they grow up thinking, if i do things wrong, ppl wont like me as much.


Emotional punishment on a child is just as bad as physical.


I want to explain why things are right and wrong, and for them to understand.

if a kid does something wrong, and i legitimately believe he had forgotten it was bad, or just didnt know better, i wouldnt punish, cause he wasnt doing it on purpose, i would explain why he shouldn't do it again.



Back talking won't exist in my home, because it will be viewed in a positive light. I know for a FACT there have been cases in my life, were my parents were truly and utterly WRONG and I was in the right, and theres nothing worse then being punished when you don't deserve it, or for telling someone their not right. Its not my child's fault if i make a mistake, if they can prove to me their point is right, or even make me view things from their perspective, good for them.

i don't want my kids bowing down to authority figures, i want them questioning everything, and figuring things out for their selves, not just being told.




As for hitting, its bad, as for shoutting at your child, its bad, as for taking away your childs enjoyment, or humiliating them, just as bad.



make them understand why they shouldn't do things, and they won't.


praise them not only when their good but all the time, never make your child become afraid of F*cking up.



everyone makes mistakes, and you havnt to understand this.



if i purposly never fed my dog all week cause i didnt feel like walking outside, and i got 1 week grounding.

and then the next week, i honestly forgot to feed it, and got 1 week of grounding, is it far to get the same punishment? no.


If your gonna punish the same for forgetting, then your not being fair. perhaps have a punishment, only for forgetting stuff, and no matter what you forgot, or the consequences of forgetting, the same punishment, cause honestly, our brains forget serious things the same way they forget minor ones.


okay, im done. -Phoenix

 

[Red Dawn]

I don't think punishment works at all. If I do something bad, and my mum grounds me/pc bans me etc, then I don't go 'Wow I'm never going to do that again' It's more like 'Fuck, how could I be so stupid as to get caught?!'. Next time i'll try to be more careful.

The other day I had a file at school, and I got in BIG BIG trouble. Got MSB (Stupid punishment 1 step down from suspension) for a day, because I had a file that I had turned into a Bo Shuriken (stick-like ninja weapon). I got in trouble for possession of lethal weapons or something, now am I going to think I've done wrong and not make weapons anymore? Hell no! I just get pissed off at the school and resolve not to take any weaponry out in front of teachers any more. I got caught by cops playing with explosives, got taken home, in lots of trouble, same thing again.
Because I have a different opinion on what's 'right' or 'wrong' than most adults around me, being punished isn't going to teach me that I shouldn't do stuff, I continue to think that my shit is awesome and others are unfair. Unless they can convince me not to play with weapons and explosives then I will continue to do so, and the risk of getting detentions or being grounded isn't going to stop me.

 

[Andy6000]

Maybe one of these times you'll kill yourself or someone. Better to get detentions and get grounded before you actually fuck up and get a real penalty. That's what they want you to learn (and if nobody is telling you this, they're failures). Having the viewpoint that weapons capable of easily killing someone or explosives that can kill/maim you are awesome is ridiculous, the adults around you are adults for a reason, they know things that you don't, that cop has probably fucked around with explosives at some point in his life, and he probably knows that they're dangerous.

 

[lunarea]

What makes a good parent depends entirely on the person's point of view.

If you ask a child, they might tell you that a good parent is someone who takes care of them, reads them stories before bed, buys them candy, plays hide and seek, goes treasure hunting, knows the answers to all questions in the world, and can do really cool gross things like shoot noodles out of their nose.

If you ask a teen, they might tell you that a good parent is someone that's totally cool with tatoos, recreational drugs, has money - and is very generous with it, lets them stay out as much as they'd like, hosts wicked parties at any given time, makes all the grub while cleaning up, and can do really cool things like making themselves invisible whenever someone cool walks by.

If you ask a grown adult, they might tell you that a good parent is someone who is supportive, can take care of themselves at their late age, is full of valuable advice, and can do really cool things like babysitting the grandkids every weekend.

Now, if you actually ask a parent, they might tell you that it's anyone who can go through raising a child without going insane, who loves their children unconditionally - especially when they're being difficult, who protects their children from harm (when they can), and who is, at the end of the day, generally happy that they've got kids.

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

You can't say "punishments don't work", they do. They may not be working for particular people because they are the wrong punishments.

I remember being punished in a common manner one day. I was really young, single digit years, and it's one of the few memories I still have from those years. I was grounded and sent to my room. I couldn't play with toys.

Instead I got very bored and started singing along whatever songs I liked - got yelled at and wasn't allowed to sing again. I wasn't angry, but I became bored quickly yet again. I ended up for whatever reason grabbing strings from the carpet and making little people out of the string, held together by weaving and my own childhood spit. They had little instruments and they could play all the songs I liked, long as I didn't sing 'em cause no one else heard.

That punishment obviously didn't work. I got caught doing this too when my mother came upstairs and I hadn't noticed her, and I got yelled at for that too. Next time I would get the "sit and don't do anything" punishment, it was in the kitchen while my mom paid bills. I had to sit and do nothing with my hands on the table. For me this was horrible.
All ups in hyperactivity with the inability to stand still, all I did was get scolded for fidgeting in that uncomfortable chair.

I was a good kid for months. I feared having to sit there for another 2 hours again.

 

[rexxzecutioner]

I am 100% confidant that I would be an excellent father.

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

So claimed Girard Lafortune as well.

 

[rexxzecutioner]

I am not him.

 

[sixtyandaquarter]

So you claim.

No one who can be sure of anything about themselves in my eyes can ever be fully trusted. It's ingrained into my way of perception. If you can't fear failure, I can't see you being beyond it. In fact I'd say you'd be more prone to it.