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Astral Projection

I'm just curious if anyone here has ever tried Astral Projection. It's almost like Lucid Dreaming, only you're more awake and its easier. Pretty trippy thing to do. If anyone wants tactics or anything on it,
Code:
http://www.crystalinks.com/astral.html
is a site that has different ways to achieve it. Its an Out of Body ability basically.

(if the link is against the rules tell me)
 

mawk

Sponsor

Personally I don't buy into any of this stuff. Lucid dreaming, yes. Making your soul or psychic presence or whatever leave your body? No. It just seems like wishful thinking backed with weak logic and a skewed interpretation of personal experience to me -- while not on par with the websites claiming that Jesus was actually a messenger from another planet sent to combat people in the Earth's core who operate machines which send bad vibes to humanity (and are paid for their effort with breathable oxygen,) they both occupy the same niche in my mind.

I think this whole conversation has already been played out in other threads? I'm going to leave it open, though, just because I think it'll be funny... and there's probably actually a lot of potential for discussion here, I just don't want to get involved because I think that this sort of thing is part of what's wrong with humanity in general right now.
 
yes, this sounds wierd, but i have tried this. i haven't necessarily archived astral projection, but i have come into a clear state of mind, perfect for making descisions. I think that true astral projection, if at all, is just a clear state of mind, one with no interruptions, maybe the best way to describe this is as an awakened sleep. confusing. i know.
 
I was trying the orb thing a few minutes ago. I actually got scared because I was in a lit room and was able to go so numb within a minute. If astral projection is real, I'll tell you Tomorrow.
 
If astral projection is real, I'll tell you Tomorrow.

I feel like I'm killing the suspense by letting everyone know early but I just can't help myself.

It's not.

People who are psychic, magic or whatever else are all lying, it's a nice idea and certainly an entertaining one, it's understandable that people would want to believe it's real but seriously, are you actually going to fool yourself into believing something because you want it to be true?
 
Chimmy Ray":2gljtvpe said:
I just don't want to get involved because I think that this sort of thing is part of what's wrong with humanity in general right now.
This is what's wrong with humanity right now?  Hope, dreams, and ideas?  I think corruption of government is much worse than astral projection.  How often has astral projection led to nuclear war?

bluehazed":2gljtvpe said:
yes, this sounds wierd, but i have tried this. i haven't necessarily archived astral projection, but i have come into a clear state of mind, perfect for making descisions. I think that true astral projection, if at all, is just a clear state of mind, one with no interruptions, maybe the best way to describe this is as an awakened sleep. confusing. i know.
This is the general idea behind meditation.  It's useful for clearing the mind, especially when trying to get to sleep and your mind is racing.

Basically, astral projection is the same as any spiritual idea, whether it be a part of a religion or separate.  It's something that can't be proven (yet) and people try to find explanations for their own experiences.  As long as it doesn't have any harmful side effects, I have no trouble with people trying it.  In other words, don't substitute religion for medicine.  If you feel like you're having a heart attack, don't pray to God instead of going to a hospital.  I would be cautious, shiroun, because losing circulation isn't a good sign, no matter what you're doing.

Do I believe in astral projection?  Yes.  I don't think I want to try it, but I believe there is some truth behind the claims. 
iceplosion":2gljtvpe said:
If astral projection is real, I'll tell you Tomorrow.

I feel like I'm killing the suspense by letting everyone know early but I just can't help myself.

It's not.

People who are psychic, magic or whatever else are all lying, it's a nice idea and certainly an entertaining one, it's understandable that people would want to believe it's real but seriously, are you actually going to fool yourself into believing something because you want it to be true?
People believe that a man was killed and reborn.  They believe someone built a giant ark and a single person managed to get two of each species inside it when the Earth flooded, covering everything, even mountains.  Some still believe Earth was created in seven days by a bored god.  How is this any different?  Is it so different because it hasn't been made into a system of government?  Maybe it's because these things have been used in different forms, such as magic tricks and witchcraft, which are thought of as either childish or evil.  Maybe we're simply scared of what we don't understand.

I believe this can become a good discussion of ideas.  (Hint: Discussion of ideas, not Guardianism.)
 

mawk

Sponsor

Guardian1239":2s6mtc3n said:
This is what's wrong with humanity right now?  Hope, dreams, and ideas?

Self-delusion, actually, but you were close.

Now if you don't mind, I'm going to continue not touching this discussion with a ten foot pole.
 
Chimmy Ray":2oa71ier said:
Guardian1239":2oa71ier said:
This is what's wrong with humanity right now?  Hope, dreams, and ideas?

Self-delusion, actually, but you were close.

Now if you don't mind, I'm going to continue not touching this discussion with a ten foot pole.
Ah, now I see what you meant.  However, I'd rather have self-delusion than corruption any day.  Self delusion in this essence isn't harmful to anybody.  Self delusion in other ways is dangerous, such as the idea that you'll be rewarded for blowing up thousands of people, but these ideas are harmless.  Overall, it's the person who eventually does the damage, not the ideas behind them.  I'd like to hear what you have to say about this topic, but, first of all, this isn't the thread to do it in, and secondly I don't blame you for not wanting to continue.  I've seen how radical some people can get. ^-^;  If you want to discuss the topic more, you can PM me.  I don't bite...hard.
 
Self delusion in this essence isn't harmful to anybody.

Yeah, no one has ever been hurt because of religion.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_inquisition
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jihad#Jihad_as_warfare

Oh wait...

such as the idea that you'll be rewarded for blowing up thousands of people, but these ideas are harmless.

Now we're going seriously off topic, this isn't about religion, it's shiroun trying astral projection, but I'm gonna go ahead and say that this is ridiculous, that is not a harmless idea, it's an idea that has led to millions of deaths.

it's the person who eventually does the damage, not the ideas behind them

It's the ideas that drive them to do it.

Although seriously...this is way off topic.
 
Um, isn't astral projection just ... imagination?

I mean, you're imagining yourself going away from your body ...

... You never wake up and go, "oshit i'm on mars lol", it's all imagining it ...

So ...

Isn't that just imagination o_o
 

mawk

Sponsor

'Zactly.

If you go to sleep thinking about astral projection, chances are you'll dream that you are astrally projecting, much like what happens if you fall asleep with thoughts of women (or anything else I guess) in your head. It's really very difficult to separate any potential genuine experiences from wishful thinking manifested in a dream.

Not bucking on the techniques they suggest, though. Chances are they are genuinely effective for meditation and that sort of thing (I'm not sure how much of that instant clarity was placebo effect, but it's safe to say they probably work to a large extent as a meditational technique,) but I don't think there's a lot that'll help you send your mind outside your body using your shining soooul.

Guardian, self-delusion is the key to almost everything. Bad dudes don't go around thinking "oh im just so darned evil i think i'll go screw some people over," they rationalize it to themselves. This can be applied to most bad dudes I can think of, but you're right, this is hardly the time or the place -- and I don't feel like waxing philosophical over PM where no one but you can see how clever and thoughtful I am.

Wasn't I going to avoid this thread? Eh, I can never stay away from honeypots.
 
Chimmy Ray":1jan8thh said:
'Zactly.

If you go to sleep thinking about astral projection, chances are you'll dream that you are astrally projecting, much like what happens if you fall asleep with thoughts of women (or anything else I guess) in your head. It's really very difficult to separate any potential genuine experiences from wishful thinking manifested in a dream.

you're so sure theres such little difference between a typical dream, and an out of body experience?
 
Someone prove differently. Yeah, yeah, no one can prove anything.
How can anyone be sure it's not just certain people experiencing a particularly vivid dream, and they're drama queens about it?
 
I guess that's true, Venetia.  I've had some weird dreams that have felt real and I sometimes wonder what was the purpose behind it.  Most of my dreams are pretty obvious, but some I have trouble figuring out what my brain was thinking.  However, I do think some people have had something more than just dreams at times.  Story time!

My aunt's (mom's sister) wedding was coming up in the next couple of days.  She had just bought her dress yesterday and was going to show my mom the dress the next day and tell her their plan for the wedding.  Well, that night, my mom had a dream that she witnessed everything about the wedding - leaving the house, the ceremony, and leaving, where her sister died in a car accident.  She dismissed it until she saw my aunt's wedding dress, which was the same as the one in her dream.  When she explained the dream, she described the entire day, even what cars they were going to use.  My aunt freaked out, and changed everything, even what door she went out of.  She's safe (thankfully), but this story is what a lot of my ideas about dreams are based around.



Trying to tie up my view on self-delusion, I was merely saying that "deluding" oneself to believe in astral projection isn't harmful unless you're already insane.  It's not a violent practice in any way.  I doubt millions of people have died from astral projection (I was using "these ideas" to link back to astral projection, not terrorism).  Other forms of self-delusion are dangerous, but not astral projection.  Also, it is, essentially, a part of a religion because it requires belief in a soul, then that belief fans out into what happens to the soul after death, etc.  Also, most of those religious events you listed were caused by people who warped the religion to create conflict.  Believing in a god and souls isn't harmful until someone puts a new spin on it.  Remember, these holy books were written by people, so there may be human anger flowing into them at some point.  But, this should be the end of this off-topic discussion.  Unless we want to make another thread, let's leave it at this: we disagree that self-delusion can be harmful in any form, and it's unlikely that we'll reach a conclusion in the next page or two if we were to continue in this thread.
 

mawk

Sponsor

(I'm not talking about exclusively astral projection. Self-delusion is used on every level of badness in this crazy juju world.

Besides, just because it doesn't make someone violent doesn't mean it's benign. You could easily lock yourself behind self-wrought bars of wishes and fancy if you're good enough at deluding yourself.)

Cruelty":2uykxmn4 said:
Chimmy Ray":2uykxmn4 said:
'Zactly.

If you go to sleep thinking about astral projection, chances are you'll dream that you are astrally projecting, much like what happens if you fall asleep with thoughts of women (or anything else I guess) in your head. It's really very difficult to separate any potential genuine experiences from wishful thinking manifested in a dream.

you're so sure theres such little difference between a typical dream, and an out of body experience?

You've had one? Help me spot the differences then, Doctor Bonzai.

I generally don't buy into any dreamshit. Your conscious mind is pretty much out for the count, including the centers of intellect and reason, and your subconscious is free to do whatever it wants. Your conscious mind can see some weird shit, and its capacity to tell the difference between reality and the dream is severely diminished. (You ever get really stupid when you're exhausted? Imagine what you must be like when you're asleep!) If you really want to believe that something from the dream was a genuine experience, your frontal lobe isn't going to put up that much of a fight.

I know people who get deja vu and get really excited because they like to believe that deja vu is a sign of genuine precognition on their part -- that they had prophesied whatever was going on when the deja vu hit and had just plumb forgot about it until then. I don't like to be around them too much because I think they're fanciful morons and totally uninteresting aside from the whole delusional thing. This is the way I see astral projection, too -- a completely mundane occurrence given a lot of extra significance by a lot of delusion and wishful thinking.
 
I read about a study in which people (I'm assuming they had white coats) - it was a fairly decent scientific minded person writing this book (It's Brian Green - either The Fabric of Reality, or the Elegant Universe), so I assume they checked the authenticity of this study... anyway...

I read about a study in which people were basically exposed to large electromagnetic thingies (the scientific term) in an attempt to induce an out of body experience, in a similar pattern to things like MK-Ultra or the various memory experiments which have been taking place for the last fifty years (inducing memories, that sort of thing).

Their methodology basically involved inducing sleep and shocking various portions of the brain which they seemed to think would respond to these stimulus. The participent was sent to sleep with the instructions that they were to find a particular road nearby and note things like parked car colours and types.

They, as you might expect, had some rather patchy results. Some people didn't experience anything, and some did - but got it wrong. Some came with incredibly vivid accounts including things like particular people or things that were happening at the same time.

There were people stationed in the target streets all day making a note of what cars were parked where etc. Some actually matched the list of cars identified by the recorders at the time the experiments were taking place. Some matched at other times - slightly earlier or later. The really interesting thing about the experiment was that one of the participents allegedly produced a vivid account of seeing the head honcho, who was conducting the experiment, checking the various cars, along with various other details, like a man on his bike, a punk with an alsation. A man with a bowler hat tripping over an old  pushchair...that sort of thing. The scientist was disappointed mainly because he didn't go out and do the counting bits - so that invalidated the entire account as far as he was concerned. Later that day, however, the guy who was supposed to be car counting did not come back when requested so... so the head honcho went looking for him in his street and...you'll never guess what happened! Well actually, you're all smart people so you've probably worked out where this is leading and what he saw there. ;)

Simple chance and probabilities? The human mind showing it's falibilities. A badly done experiment? Or maybe there is something more to it but it's hard to test empirically. Most of that was just anecdotal evidence, and I'm sure everyone has a particular story of that kind they could share.

The point is, there could be a mechanism in the universe by which these sorts of things occur, just as certain people are more sensitive to changing weather pressures... or electricity supplies...or whatever, but one which we just have not found yet.

But I can safely say one thing: such an answer could never be found at a site named "Crystallinks" or whatever! ;)
 

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